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Do pro-lifers really think abortion is murder?

Inconsistency

by: micah

Pro-lifers are always saying that abortion is murder. But do pro-lifers themselves really believe it? Imagine if during a robbery a robber shoots a 1 year old baby because the store-owner was not getting the money fast enough. Could you imagine anyone saying things like, "It's important we change the robbers' hearts and minds". Or if you were asked what a judge should do to the robbers, would you say, "Well I'm not really sure. I think the important thing is that robbery and killing should be illegal". Or "I don't think all the robbers should go to jail, but rather only the robber that does the talking".

reply from: faithman

What if a so called anti- robber leader actually offered a reward to rat out anyone who would dare stop a robbery[can anyone say 30 pieces pavone?]? But you are exactly right. the "nicer than Jesus" crowd are not about actually stopping the slaughter. They are about "looking good" even if that means another 36 years of dead womb children. This issue is about equality thru person hood for the pre-born. Then all laws that govern the killing of the born would aply to the womb child equally, and come down to the decission of a jury of citizens. But pro-life has been infiltrated by profetii killers like CM, who try to misdirect focus from the slaughtered child onto the killers. What if all we allowed police to do was give chocolate and tea to serial killers to try and pursuade them to stop? But I guess if you are a serial womb child killer yourself, you stick up for your kind. I come a heck of alot closer to respect for you because at least you are honest, than for a phony deluded killer, who opposes the end of the slaughter, then tries to tell everyone "how prolife they are". The prob with this issue is not PP. It is the sickening sugar syrup "compassion" for killers at the expence of the womb child. That kind of compassion just has too high a price tag.

reply from: Banned Member

Mercy and justice are not incompatible.

reply from: yoda

Actually, for once, you have a valid point. How about that, carole?

reply from: faithman

Never said they were, but . CM says they are quite regularly!!

reply from: Banned Member

Pro-lifers do say that abortion is murder. Can you call yourself pro-life, and not believe that abortion is murder? I don't think so. Murder is a definable act. When you kill an innocent person, a person who has commited no offense against you or another or who otherwise has in no way threatened you or another person, it is called murder. The problem with CarolMarie's position that abortion is not murder because the law says so, is that the law which says that abortion is okay by default say that it is okay to kill an innocent person. The law problematically and incorrectly says that the subject and victim of an abortion, an unborn child, is not a person. How are we to disagree with the law, if we agree that the law is correct in its assumptions? We can't! The law is not innocent until proven guilty. The law is wrong and we who are pro-life must say that it is wrong. we must adhere to the truth that abortion is murder. That we may be compassionate or understanding as to why a person commited that murder is secondary to the claim that abortion is murder. While it may be a noble endeavor to provide aid and comfort to those who have commited grave acts, our first obligation in any violent act which takes the life of a innocent human being is to address the concerns and seek justice for the victim, not to console those who have commited the crime.

reply from: Faramir

I would rather say it is "the unjust killing of a human person," since murder is illegal and abortion is not.
Since our culture and the law tell us that abortion is good, then if abortion is an injustice and kills a person, then WHO is the murderER?

reply from: Banned Member

It is the law which permits the killing of unborn children with abortion which is wrong, not the definition of murder.
Our first obligation in any violent crime which takes the life of a innocent human being is to seek justice for the victim, not to console those who have commited the crime.

reply from: Faramir

What should be done to get justice for these victims of an unjust but legal act?
A law against abortion and one which punishes the mothers would not be retroative, so there is no way they can be legally punished.
What do you think should be done?

reply from: Banned Member

When did I state that the law should be retroactive?
The law needs to be changed making any further abortions illegal, starting with the first abortion after the change in the law. Justice for the unborn would be made a precedent by prosecuting abortion early and often and without exception. Every other condition and consideration that is given to a case of murder would apply, including all conditions and circumstances surrounding the abortion and the accused.

reply from: Banned Member

"Son of man, I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel; whenever you hear a word from my mouth, you shall give them warning from me. If I say to the wicked,
You shall surely die,' and you give him no warning, nor speak to warn the wicked from his wicked way, in order to save his life, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at your hand. But if you warn the wicked, and he does not turn from his wickedness, or from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you will have saved your life. Again, if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits iniquity, and I lay a stumbling block before him, he shall die; because you have not warned him, he shall die for his sin, and his righteous deeds which he has done shall not be remembered; but his blood I will require at your hand. Nevertheless if you warn the righteous man not to sin, and he does not sin, he shall surely live, because he took warning; and you will have saved your life." - Ezekiel 3:17-21

reply from: Faramir

The law needs to be changed making any further abortions illegal, starting with the first abortion after the change in the law. Justice for the unborn would be made a precedent by prosecuting abortion early and often and without exception. Every other condition and consideration that is given to a case of murder would apply, including all conditions and circumstances surrounding the abortion and the accused.
I thought you meant you saw that abortion RIGHT NOW is murder, and that RIGHT NOW those involved should be brought to justice for the sake of the victim.

reply from: Banned Member

Abortion is murder now, right now! But we cannot prosecute what is right now only morally a crime, and not legally a crime. That is why it is imperative that abortion be made illegal as soon as possible. State sanctioned murder is happening every day. Only when it becomes a crime can we prosecute. That doesn't in any way mean that we, right here and now, do not understand that abortion is a crime. We know that abortion is murder. We have to make that clear to every person so that the law may be changes as soon as possible and the killing put to an end.

reply from: faithman

The law needs to be changed making any further abortions illegal, starting with the first abortion after the change in the law. Justice for the unborn would be made a precedent by prosecuting abortion early and often and without exception. Every other condition and consideration that is given to a case of murder would apply, including all conditions and circumstances surrounding the abortion and the accused.
I thought you meant you saw that abortion RIGHT NOW is murder, and that RIGHT NOW those involved should be brought to justice for the sake of the victim.
sounds good to me...

reply from: Banned Member

How can anyone would claims to be against the killing of unborn children, make that argument by saying that abortion is not now murder?
As I said... it is the law which permits the killing of unborn children which is wrong, not any definition of murder.
The definition of abortion changed only 36 years ago. The definition of murder hasn't changed in the last 5000 years!

reply from: Faramir

It's not an "argument" but a fact. If it is murder, then try calling the police about it and see who gets charged.
Abortion is legal.
If it were illegal, I would not be posting here about it.
Since the law and our culture sanction it, if it IS murder, then who are the murderers?

reply from: Banned Member

Understand this... Murder is a specific action, not a crime. If the state says that murder is legal under certain circumstances, than it is legal under certain circumstances. The state has brought us into the paradox of certain types of legal murder and illegal murder. We call the police when people break state and federal laws, not moral precepts.

reply from: Faramir

If it's morally a crime, do we need to do something to get some kind of justice for the victims (the babies) while it is still legal?
You seem very opposed to seeing women who abort as victims themselves, or in showing compassion to them.

reply from: nancyu

I don't know what pro-lifers think. Are you talking pp pro lifers? or $pro lifers? or cm pro lifers?
I also don't know what abortion is, is there such a thing? But if you are asking 'is it illegal to murder persons before or after they are born?' then yes it is. The same protection against murder that applies to persons after they are born, should be applied to persons before they are born.
VV Look VV.

reply from: Banned Member

"the unjust killing of a human person"
Why unjust? If not murder, why unjust? The state has justified the killing of the unborn, therefore, must abortion not be just because the state says so? If you accept that what the state calls just, is just, than how can you say that the state is also wrong, when the state says that abortion is a right?
Call abortion for what it is, murder. Or call abortion for what it isn't, a right. But you cannot say that abortion is wrong and also say that the state it right. The state must either be right, or wrong. It cannot be both. Neither can you.

reply from: Faramir

"Unjust" covers it all.
It's legal, but not just. It's an injustice because it robs a human person of his most basic right.
The law is wrong and needs to be changed.
But if it is murder in the moral sense, which I think it is, WHO are the murderers?
I think it's very short sighted and unfair to look at the women who abort and call them murderers when the law and our culture is telling them it is their right. Whether we like it or not, you and I are part of that culture and you and I are in part responsible. ALL of us are in this and ALL of us are murderers, if it is murder.

reply from: Banned Member

So... legal can be unjust, but unjust as it mean the killing of unborn persons, cannot be murder? Care to explain that?
The mothers.
The same law and culture tell me that it is their right to abort. I don't believe them because I choose not to believe them. Why don't the mothers?
Speak for yourself.

reply from: Faramir

The mothers.
That's where I disagree and it's only true in-part and only true in certain circumstances.
The man who knocks up his girlfriend who later aborts, even against his wishes, is just as much the "murderer" as she is.
The person who votes for the prochoice candidate is just as much a murderer.
The law which says that abortion is good, is just as much a murderer.
Anyone who has sinned and is part of our culture has helped make it what it is, is a murderer.
You are in-part a murderer and are in-part culpbable for the sin of abortion, as am I, even though you and I have never directly participated in an abortion.

reply from: Banned Member

That's where you are wrong. Abortion is always murder. The circumstances only determine the extent of guilt.
Wrong again! Murder is the act of a person, or persons by way of choosing to kill another innocent person. Fathering a child, even in the most uncommited or irresponsible of ways is not the same as murder. A woman always has the right and obligation to choose life, even if the father is screaming in her face to have an abortion. Stop shifting the blame around.
I am inclined to agree with this. But a person who has no knowledge of candidates view on abortion, having never had one or perhaps even personally known a person who had an abortion, is not quite as guilty as someone who has an abortion themself who claims to not know what abortion is.
Persons murder, not laws. The people that pass and support and defend those laws, yes, they are guilty of murder.
Not all sin is murder, nor is every murder abortion. That people are not perfect and are unable to bring about a perfect society does not make them guilty of murder. "Everyone is guilty" is just as flawed as "No one is guilty".
Speak for yourself or speak for no one. But do not speak for me. Again, "Everyone is guilty" is just as flawed an argument as "No one is guilty". Just because you are incapable of blaming the guilty does not mean that you can blame everyone.

reply from: Faramir

I'm speaking in the moral sense, and I'm not speaking FOR you but TO you, and I'm being reasonable and civil, and am not making any personal attacks as you did to me.
You are a sinner and are responsible for adding your sins to our culture, and are therefore in-part responsible for the evils of our culture, as am I.
But I can blame "the guilty" too, since they bear the most culpability, but that culpability is lessened by ignorance, outward pressures, and by the culture you helped create.
Those who choose to do evil do bear the responsibility for their actions and should suffer the consequences, but in the case of abortion, there are many accomplices and some, in our present culture and legal environment, who are more guilty and more culpable than "the mothers" who are often victims themselves.
I don't mean that "everyone is guilty" in the sense that there is no such thing as crime and nobody should go to jail.
I mean that as a Catholic, I can see that all of humanity is bound together and that we have all sinned and fallen short of what we should be. Anyone who has sinned has contributed to the fallenness of the world, and sometimes those who seem to sin so greiviously have been "sinned against" more than they have sinned, and sometimes those who participate in the injustice of abortion do so because of unjust circumstances they are suffering.
That's why it is good to reach out with kindness and compassion to the post-abortive. They've been pushed to do what they did and were given the blessings of the state.
Until it is made clear to all that abortion is unjust and until the law reflects that, "the mothers" are often no more guilty than the rest of us.

reply from: carolemarie

Actually, for once, you have a valid point. How about that, carole?
Abortion is LEGAL,shooting babies during an armed robbery is not legal.

reply from: faithman

Actually, for once, you have a valid point. How about that, carole?
Abortion is LEGAL,shooting babies during an armed robbery is not legal.
Just like a true profetii killer. Always falls back on "legality". Anything as long as the blood freely flows!!

reply from: Banned Member

Legality is the problem. Abortion happens because of legality. You cannot respect laws which defend state sanctioned murder. Abortion is murder. The law MUST reflect that! If you are pro-life, that is your goal.

reply from: carolemarie

Actually, for once, you have a valid point. How about that, carole?
Abortion is LEGAL,shooting babies during an armed robbery is not legal.
Just like a true profetii killer. Always falls back on "legality". Anything as long as the blood freely flows!!
I am not for abortion.
But abortion is LEGAL, thereforth it is not the same thing as killing a born person. One act is against the law and we all know that it is wrong.
The other act is not against the law and plenty don't know it is wrong.

reply from: Banned Member

It is the law which permits the killing of unborn children which is incorrect, not the definition of murder!

reply from: Banned Member

CarolMarie, unless you, and others, can commit yourself to the idea that killing unborn children is the exact same thing as killing born children, and convince others of the same, than abortion WILL ALWAYS be legal.
You have dumbed down the definition of abortion and murder to lessen your guilt and that of others to avoid the stigma of having comitted the very act which your profess to be against. Your own words have undermined you however and reveal your lack of commitment. Abortion may be offensive to you, but until you embrace the truth, I don't think that you can ever authentically call yourself pro-life.

reply from: nancyu

Actually, for once, you have a valid point. How about that, carole?
Abortion is LEGAL,shooting babies during an armed robbery is not legal.
Killing unborn children IS NOT LEGAL.

reply from: carolemarie

I know, how could I be prolife? I mean what is sidewalk counseling and working at CPC's and working for prolife legislation compared to posting on a board and telling other people that they are not up to your standards and are not prolife??

reply from: Faramir

CarolMarie, unless you, and others, can commit yourself to the idea that killing unborn children is the exact same thing as killing born children, and convince others of the same, than abortion WILL ALWAYS be legal.
You have dumbed down the definition of abortion and murder to lessen your guilt and that of others to avoid the stigma of having comitted the very act which your profess to be against. Your own words have undermined you however and reveal your lack of commitment. Abortion may be offensive to you, but until you embrace the truth, I don't think that you can ever authentically call yourself pro-life.
How can someone "dum down" the definition of abortion?
Let's see, she's saved hundreds of babies in her pro-life work, and you just flap your gums on the internet, and are somehow an authority as to who is pro-life and who isn't. Your "work" doesn't hold a candle to what she does, and yet you pompously and selfrighteously sit in judgement of her.
The sad reality is that abortion is legal. That's just stating a fact, and prolifers want abortion to be ILlegal.
While abortion is legal, much of the culpablity is on our culture and legal system for giving permission and encouragement to abort.
You can cry all you want about making sure "the mothers" are properly humilited, shamed, mocked, whatever...but until our legal system and culture say that abortion is immoral and illegal, there is much blame to go around, and it's unfair and unjust to focus it on "the mothers."

reply from: Banned Member

Post abortion counseling does not save babies!

reply from: Faramir

She does PRE abortion counseling that DOES save babies.
Where have you been?
And POST abortion counseling can save the next baby.

reply from: Banned Member

Laws stating that abortion is murder would aim to save every baby! CarolMarie opposes this kind of law! She apparently believes that the laws are okay the way they stand. She also endorses precautionary abortion in cases relating to a mother health. She is pro-life; with exceptions! She is somewhat better intentioned than most mainstream pro-choice NARAL and Planned Parenthood public reps. That's not pro-life! It's self righteousness!

reply from: carolemarie

It actually does help save the next baby and help make another women free to be prolife, and when she talks to others she shares why she is prolife from a personal testimony, she is able to sway them to a prolife position.
But I don't only do the post-abortion outreach. I do it but the last thing I want is anyone to have an abortion. That is why I reach out before the abortion and help women choose life....
That is why I stand there with my I regret my abortion sign and talk to those going in....because I want to spare them the sorrow and regret that comes with abortion, and because I care about them and want to help them have their child and help them with whatever is making them choose abortion.
So don't tell me I am not prolife! I spend my time and money helping women choose life. It isn't abstract to me or a political issue. Its personal.

reply from: Banned Member

http://www.ewtn.com/library/PROLIFE/piromaxkolbe.htm
In the United States alone, the number of abortions per year is 1.37 million (for the year 1996) and the number of abortions per day is approximately 3,700. One interesting statistic tells why women have abortions. 1% of all abortions in the United States occur because of rape or incest; 6% occur because of potential health problems regarding either mother or child, and 93% of all abortions occur for social reasons, namely if the child is unwanted or inconvenient.
The overwhelming scientific evidence confirms that the fruit of conception in the mother's womb is a human being. And, if so, the willful and deliberate termination of pregnancy through abortion is murder, plain and simple. And if it is murder, nothing in the world can justify it. No one is free to kill. Freedom of choice can make sense when it comes to choosing a car, a restaurant, a store, a profession, etc. To speak of freedom of choice when a human life is involved is not only irresponsible but it is also an insul to our intelligence. In their zeal to pursue their particular agenda, some people make fools out of themselves, as to when they use the word "reproductive" to assert their right to an abortion. How is it possible to reproduce by killing? In their twisted minds they even twist and obfuscate the language itself.
Although abortion is not a religious matter, we Catholics, to be true witnesses to God's gift of life, on the example of St. Maximilian Mary Kolbe, must be guided by the teaching of the Catholic Church, which has always condemned abortion as a grave evil. Doing otherwise makes us "cafeteria Catholics", in other words it makes us no Catholics at all.
Christian writers, from the first-century author of the Didache to Pope John Paul II in his encyclical "Evangelium Vitae" ("The Gospel of Life), have maintained that the Bible forbids abortion, just as it forbids murder.

reply from: Faramir

Are you going to admit your error, Augustine?
Corolemarie counsels women BEFORE they abort and you misrepresneted her.
Admitting mistakes is good. It helps develop the virtue of humility, and you could use that.

reply from: Banned Member

What error? I have never condomed abortion.

reply from: carolemarie

Actually, for once, you have a valid point. How about that, carole?
Abortion is LEGAL,shooting babies during an armed robbery is not legal.
Killing unborn children IS NOT LEGAL.
Then call the police and report the crimes. Oh, yeah, it is legal....

reply from: nancyu

Actually, for once, you have a valid point. How about that, carole?
Abortion is LEGAL,shooting babies during an armed robbery is not legal.
Killing unborn children IS NOT LEGAL.
Then call the police and report the crimes. Oh, yeah, it is legal....
I promise you, I will. And no, it is not legal.

reply from: Banned Member

You are thick aren't you CarolMarie. It's no wonder that it took three abortions before you figured out that you were killing your own children. Was that before or after you got out of the prostitution business?

reply from: Faramir

Wow, you're showing your true colors this evening, aren't you?
I hope you really aren't so small and hateful as you appear. I hope it's just a temper tantrum.

reply from: Banned Member

Last I knew, prostitution was still illegal.

reply from: carolemarie

The commercial sex industry isn't just prostitution.
It is stripping, it is live sex shows, it is porn movies, working as an adult model or a cam girl., doing phone sex, peep shows. There are plenty of legal sex workers. We reach out to them as well as escorts/call girls and street hookers.
What is your problem with that?

reply from: Faramir

Last I knew, prostitution was still illegal.
Lucky for you, being a blockhead is not illegal.
I think her website is appealing to those in the pornography business, and I think pornography is unfortunately legal.
Do you have any more stones to cast?

reply from: scopia19822

"The commercial sex industry isn't just prostitution.
It is stripping, it is live sex shows, it is porn movies, working as an adult model or a cam girl., doing phone sex, peep shows. There are plenty of legal sex workers. We reach out to them as well as escorts/call girls and street hookers.
What is your problem with that?"
I think it should all be be illegal. I dont see how porn is legal, but prostitution isnt ? Both are having sex for money and are degrading to women.

reply from: carolemarie

America is now the number 3 on the list of countries of destination for sex slaves-
That desire is fueled by porn.

reply from: micah

You anti-choicers are vicious even to each other! What a sad lot you all are.

reply from: scopia19822

"America is now the number 3 on the list of countries of destination for sex slaves-
That desire is fueled by porn."
It doesnt surprise me, but it disturbes me. Porn is often made for the male viewer and from the male prespective. I have watched my share of porn, God forgive me and in every one I have seen the woman is being used for the mans gratification, not mutual pleasure on both parts.

reply from: BossMomma

Back in my younger days (18-22) I watched porn with my boyfriend/husband and while it spiced up our sex life in some of the videos I could tell that the woman was clearly not enjoying herself. Plus I hate some of the things women are called in the movies, it's degrading and I feel that women should rise above being mere sex objects and show what intelligent, strong and, compassionate people they really are.

reply from: Faramir

You're mistaken.
Some very angry small-minded people have gravitated to this forum, and are free to use it as a place to pontificate or bully others. There is no moderation here, so it brings some of the worst people, and brings out the worst in some of the best people.
Overall, prolifers are very reasonable and compassionate, and this site is in no way a fair representation or cross section, though there are some very good people here if you can see past the bitter ones.

reply from: carolemarie

Women are becoming addicted to viewing porn now.
The biggest human rights violation is human trafficing. 70% of the victims are women and children and they are sold into a life of prostitution, they are forced to service as many as 12 men a night and are given abortions by their owners. Repeat abortions, in high numbers (like 12 a year in some extreme cases)
The girls are tricked and forced and their lives are ruined. If you watch porn, you are helping cause this abuse.

reply from: scopia19822

"Back in my younger days (18-22) I watched porn with my boyfriend/husband and while it spiced up our sex life in some of the videos I could tell that the woman was clearly not enjoying herself. Plus I hate some of the things women are called in the movies, it's degrading and I feel that women should rise above being mere sex objects and show what intelligent, strong and, compassionate people they really are."
I did that too back in my younger days. Damn Boss were ancient relics . My son came home from school the other day and said Im an old dinosaoar. Porn is not a realistic portrayl of sex. It cheapens and degrades what for me is a spirtual experinece. I have read my share of porn magazines and the only one that I can say is remotley "tasteful" is Playboy. THe others clearly degrade and demean women.

reply from: micah

Half the pro-lifers on this forum routinely demean women.

reply from: carolemarie

Playboy promotes the line of thought that women are just bodies, the Chester the Molester cartoons were about sexual abuse of children. There is nothing tasteful about making women into meat, like a cow or a pig to be used.
America's biggest export is now porn---and the porn industry fights any attempt at regulation....
The girls working in strip clubs are treated as independant contractors, so they have to pay a booking fee for the right to work there, they have to tip the bartenders and waitresses and bouncers and DJ's, so there is pressure to break the rules to make up the cash they are losing. I know lots of girls including myself who started stripping underage, and stripping is where most girls get recruited into porn or other commercial sex jobs. It's like the gateway drug into the sex industry.

reply from: carolemarie

Yep, there is a lot of hate aimed at women. Mostly from men who claim to be Christians.

reply from: faithman

Yepper, you know all about abuse, you abused 3 to death, and continue to advocate for the "freedom" of future killers to do the same.

reply from: scopia19822

"Playboy promotes the line of thought that women are just bodies, the Chester the Molester cartoons were about sexual abuse of children. There is nothing tasteful about making women into meat, like a cow or a pig to be used. "
I agree. However my point was that of the major 3 porn mags Playboy, Penthouse and Hustler, Playboy is the least graphic and Hustler is the most graphic. All IMHO are disgsuting and demeanig to women.

reply from: scopia19822

"Yep, there is a lot of hate aimed at women. Mostly from men who claim to be Christians."
Pray, pray and pray. People like that are best left in Gods hands and will be judged accordingly.

reply from: Banned Member

Women are demeaned in porn, music, on the internet, in video games, in movies and sadly by men all the time in "real life". The culture goes after the males early and as much the women too. They are conditioned day in and day out to accept this kind of wrong thinking as "normal".

reply from: carolemarie

Nice comments from the Christians isn't it? With that kind of Love I am happy they stay home being hateful online...

reply from: scopia19822

"Nice comments from the Christians isn't it? With that kind of Love I am happy they stay home being hateful online..."
I would not call them Christians.

reply from: carolemarie

Funny thing is I don't doubt that they are. Which just goes to show that we are all works in progress, none of us have arrived yet.

reply from: faithman

You are a real work alright, but there is absolutly no progress going on, except becomming more pro babykiller at every turn.

reply from: scopia19822

"Funny thing is I don't doubt that they are. Which just goes to show that we are all works in progress, none of us have arrived yet."
The Jesus I worship taught forgivenss and redemption. I dont go around preaching the gospel of who would jesus kill.

reply from: carolemarie

You are a real work alright, but there is absolutly no progress going on, except becomming more pro babykiller at every turn.
I am not for "babykilling", and it is slander to say so. It is bearing false witness against your neighbor and a sin. You need to repent.

reply from: scopia19822

"I am not for "babykilling", and it is slander to say so. It is bearing false witness against your neighbor and a sin. You need to repent."
I will pray for you in that I disagree with your view on exceptions, however I think your heart is in the right place. At this point I dont know whether to call you prolife or mixed choice, but I would work with you on saving babied before I would some of the hate mongers we have on here.

reply from: faithman

You are a real work alright, but there is absolutly no progress going on, except becomming more pro babykiller at every turn.
I am not for "babykilling", and it is slander to say so. It is bearing false witness against your neighbor and a sin. You need to repent.
You are for babykilling and have said so several times. You would rather have the babies die, then call them persons with equal rights. You are willing to throw rape and incest children into the Planned parenthood trash. And you have personally killed three that you tap danced all over their memory with your justifications. I have not lied once. Get over it killer.

reply from: carolemarie

I have said that I regret my abortions. I don't make any excuses for that.
I am quite happy to work on overturning Roe, or banning the performing of abortions, and jailing those who do so. In fact, I do work for those things.
You just don't like the fact I don't like that personhood bill. Too bad.

reply from: faithman

Now who is the liar? You came here first rattle out of the box and bragged about killing your children, and said you had no regrets. Now that you were called on it, you back track and say you do. You are SSSSSOOOOO double minded. Anyone who is not for personhood and punishment for killers is not pro-life. You are a phony thru and thru, and are not pro-life. SSSSOOOO just keep posting. People are seeing you for the killer that you are.

reply from: carolemarie

Now who is the liar? You came here first rattle out of the box and bragged about killing your children, and said you had no regrets. Now that you were called on it, you back track and say you do. You are SSSSSOOOOO double minded. Anyone who is not for personhood and punishment for killers is not pro-life. You are a phony thru and thru, and are not pro-life. SSSSOOOO just keep posting. People are seeing you for the killer that you are.
Anyone who is not for personhood and punishment for killers is not pro-life
And this is your real problem with me. I don't worship your bill. Heck, I don't even like it .....
I could support the same exceptions, but back the bill and you would be all Carolemarie is sooooo prolife......you are the phony

reply from: faithman

Now who is the liar? You came here first rattle out of the box and bragged about killing your children, and said you had no regrets. Now that you were called on it, you back track and say you do. You are SSSSSOOOOO double minded. Anyone who is not for personhood and punishment for killers is not pro-life. You are a phony thru and thru, and are not pro-life. SSSSOOOO just keep posting. People are seeing you for the killer that you are.
Anyone who is not for personhood and punishment for killers is not pro-life
And this is your real problem with me. I don't worship your bill. Heck, I don't even like it .....
I could support the same exceptions, but back the bill and you would be all Carolemarie is sooooo prolife......you are the phony
There are many bills all over the country. It is not about the bills, it is about the principal behind the bills that all humans are persons. And all persons should be protected from killers like you. That is the problem. You have point blank said that womb children are not equal to born persons. That is not pro-life, and you are the pro deather here pretending to be pro-life so you can protect and defend your fellow killers.

reply from: micah

Poor carolemarie. She thinks she can actually negotiate with nut jobs. But there is no negotiation with them. They think they're on God's side, and nothing you will say will ever change their minds. Faithman et al represent the merging of zero empathy and zero intelligence.

reply from: carolemarie

You need to learn how to use the ignore button!
Ignore me, please? Pretty please ????
Do it!

reply from: faithman

Not for a second killer. The price for ignoring killers like you is dead babies. That is just way to high.

reply from: Teresa18

There is no moral difference in killing a born person and an unborn person. That's why I support ending abortion by recognizing that the unborn are persons and have the Constitutional right to life. This can be done via a personhood bill, overturning Roe vs. Wade by stating the unborn are persons and Roe vs. Wade is Unconstitutional, or by passing a Human Life Amendment.

reply from: AMozart

Killing any human life is MURDER. And yes, I am pro-life. I also really do believe it.

reply from: yoda

You've also said they were a "mistake". But why do you regret them? Because they hurt you personally? Because they cost YOU something? Why do you "regret" them?

reply from: yoda

Thank goodness there are prolifers here who recognize that, and will refute claims to the contrary by the "fauxlifers".

reply from: Witness

Abortion is murder. An innocent, helpless child is killed every, single time. The purpose of abortion is child-murder. Leroy Carhart stated that his intention in performing partial-birth is that the child die. Tiller's "ministers" tell mothers that it is all right to kill their children, because they are just sending them on to Jesus.
And I don't have the inconsistency problem you suggest, either. Everyone who willing assisted in an abortion (with the exception of those who not just converted, but actively worked to end this atrocity), should go to jail. Certainly everyone who in any way forced or coerced a mother into an abortion should go to jail. In saying "should" understand, I don't think they ever will, but I think they should. The problem is that since it is legal, prosecuting them would be difficult, if not impossible.

reply from: faithman

But the phonies oppose it because future baby killers would be brought to justice if womb children enoyed the same protection as born persons. That is the biggest rub here. The question needs to be asked over and over again why someone who says they are pro-life would fight the quickest, and most constitutional way to end the slaughter? Reguardless whether they have the courage to admit it to themselves, they are not pro-life. They defend killers which makes them profetii killer.

reply from: scopia19822

"You've also said they were a "mistake". But why do you regret them? Because they hurt you personally? Because they cost YOU something? Why do you "regret" them?"
She is saying that she by having the abortions she made mistakes, HUGE mistakes. She regrets the mistakes she made. Shes learned from those mistakes, can it get any simplier than that.

reply from: yoda

Are you her spokesperson now? I thought Farismear was her lawyer?
Have you taken over her legal representation now?

reply from: scopia19822

"Are you her spokesperson now? I thought Farismear was her lawyer?
Have you taken over her legal representation now?"
Merely translating it into language you would understand, since you didnt understand CM Yodahater.

reply from: yoda

What language does CM speak? And why can't she translate it for herself? Do you read her mind, or what?

reply from: scopia19822

"What language does CM speak? And why can't she translate it for herself? Do you read her mind, or what?"
I thought you understood English Yodahater, guess not all you understand is hate and negativity.

reply from: yoda

Do you translate into "hate and negativity"?
Is that YOUR QUALIFICATIONS to be CM's translator?


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