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Poll: Is Shame a good thing or a bad thing when we have acted immorally?

by: yoda

Should we try to help people avoid feeling ashamed by not being honest with them when they have acted immorally, committed evil acts? Should we try to make them feel okay about what they have done when they have done terrible things? Is feeling good more important than honestly feeling bad that you have done a terrible thing?

reply from: yoda

Bump for CM and vern, so they can explain this whole confusing thing to us....

reply from: faithman

YES!! inquireing minds want to know!!! They have a double standard. Killers shouldn't be shamed, but those who do shame killers should be put to shame. The lack of shame for killers is a sham, and a shame.. [Ad balla to the end of that and you got a song.]

reply from: yoda

What's the tune with that song?

reply from: faithman

On the road to planned parenthood?

reply from: yoda

Is that the tune of Willie's "On the Road Again"? I think PP sings it like "On the pill again, I'm so glad to be on the pill again, I'm having sex and abortions with my friends, and I'm so glad to be on the pill again!"

reply from: faithman

Let's seeeeee..... On the road again... just can't wait to get on the boards again..... the life I lead is killing babies with my friends.... i just can't wait to go to planed parenthood again !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!............ [Dad gone dogs]

reply from: faithman

HHHHMMMMM, you ought to sing this one on the birth control thred.

reply from: yoda

bump for carolemarie and vern

reply from: ChristianLott2

shame on you for telling us shame is okay when we've done wrong mr hater. no female should ever need to feel ashamed for anything, no matter how wrong she was because.. she's a female.. and especially when she's made an innocent little mistake like slaughter a tiny innocent baby.
all she really needs is a free bag of chocolates.

reply from: faithman

YEAH!!!! you ole shame monger you!!!!!!!!! Shame on you for advocating shame!!! We should all call you shameful names and advocate that you be shamed into stop shameing the shameless.

reply from: faithman

[is there shame in spam????]What the bortheads, and the false pro-lifers do not understand, is that there is more to life than this physical world, and our physical bodies. Our bodies are merely the containers of the precious substance Called life. Life has to have that container to express itself in the natural world. Even if the container is flawed, it still makes it possible for the miracle of life to be expressed. Our common value is not found in the container, but what is contained. The life of a womb child is equal to the life contained in all of us. The only legitimate breaking of this container, is if it has the compunction to smash other containers without cause. When you take way the ability to express life, you loose the great privilege to express your own. Evil aggression must be subdued, or no container can have any security from unjust breakage. To take away the possibility of this wonderful spark of life to be expressed, makes this world a darker place, and the rest of us containers a little more impoverished, and alone. Though the womb child is a small container, it does not lessen the value of the life it contains. If fellow containers do not value the life of the womb child container, then they have placed their personhood container in great jeopardy. Anyone who does not see that womb children are fellow human containers, containing life of equal value to their own, is a self destructive fool, drunk on the power to kill, and must be stopped for the sake of the rest of us life containers. It is the life in us that makes us equal, not our degree of ability to express it.
[obviously not]

reply from: ChristianLott2

I don't know. I jus don't like feeling bad and I hate anybody who hurts my feelings and I don't care if what they're saying is true.

reply from: faithman

[I was actually thinking B W Stevenson, and three dog night, but willy will work just fine]

reply from: Rosalie

You appear to be horribly interested in other people's sexual lives. What's up with that? Don't you have YOUR sex life to worry about? Probably not, though.
All three of you act like complete psychos. But you'd have to be smart and sane to realize what kind of disservice you are doing to your movement and yourself by behaving like that.

reply from: ChristianLott2

Busted!
Now Rosalie wants to be part of the bm, rml, cm, lib "pro life movement"!
Of course she does, because it's the same as the pro CHOICE "movement".

reply from: ProInformed

Hey, if that is what YOU believe, then why don't YOU mind YOUR own business and allow Yodavater to express his own feelings, eh?
Now to answer your question:
ALL sociopaths would love it if everybody else would 'mind their own' business while they BRUTALLY KILLED their innocent victims.
But in a civilized society we don't allow the desire of those who commit fatal acts of violence (or even non-fatal acts of violence for that matter) to be used to chastise us into 'minding our own business'.
The thing is there ARE people who cannot be 'made to' feel guilt over anything they choose to do, even something as vile and cruel as killing an innocent baby.
Such people are sociopathic. So in their case it doesn't really matter one bit if somebody else is trying to make them feel guilt - they simply won't care.
Are you so naive that you believe such sociopaths actually feel hurt or ashamed when they are called killers? They ARE killers BECAUSE they totally lack empathy for heir victims!
Now I am not saying that all women who have abortions are sociopathic, many have been lied to and/or coerced to abort. To that sort of woman it might cause them some hurt, shame, or embarrassment to be called a killer... IF they were still defending what they did and excusing it in any way.
Pro-aborts insist that women do NOT feel any regret from having killed their own babies by abortion... but then whine that the same women have to be spoken to very carefully or else they might become upset... Hmmm, so if the same deception and pro-abortion grooming and influences aren't applied to those women for the rest of their lives THEN they will feel regret or shame, eh? The only way you pro-aborts can pretend there is no such thing as post-abortion regrets is to 'protect' the woman's state of denial, huh? You admit that when she finds out the gruesome truth THEN she will feel grief, right?

reply from: faithman

Hey, if that is what YOU believe, then why don't YOU mind YOUR own business and allow Yodavater to express his own feelings, eh?
Now to answer your question:
ALL sociopaths would love it if everybody else would 'mind their own' business while they BRUTALLY KILLED their innocent victims.
But in a civilized society we don't allow the desire of those who commit fatal acts of violence (or even non-fatal acts of violence for that matter) to be used to chastise us into 'minding our own business'.
The thing is there ARE people who cannot be 'made to' feel guilt over anything they choose to do, even something as vile and cruel as killing an innocent baby.
Such people are sociopathic. So in their case it doesn't really matter one bit if somebody else is trying to make them feel guilt - they simply won't care.
Are you so naive that you believe such sociopaths actually feel hurt or ashamed when they are called killers? They ARE killers BECAUSE they totally lack empathy for heir victims!
Now I am not saying that all women who have abortions are sociopathic, many have been lied to and/or coerced to abort. To that sort of woman it might cause them some hurt, shame, or embarrassment to be called a killer... IF they were still defending what they did and excusing it in any way.
Pro-aborts insist that women do NOT feel any regret from having killed their own babies by abortion... but then whine that the same women have to be spoken to very carefully or else they might become upset... Hmmm, so if the same deception and pro-abortion grooming and influences aren't applied to those women for the rest of their lives THEN they will feel regret or shame, eh? The only way you pro-aborts can pretend there is no such thing as post-abortion regrets is to 'protect' the woman's state of denial, huh? You admit that when she finds out the gruesome truth THEN she will feel grief, right?
Even the killer of 3 admits it don't look at abortion pictures because it made it feel bad.

reply from: ProInformed

Busted!
Now Rosalie wants to be part of the bm, rml, cm, lib "pro life movement"!
Of course she does, because it's the same as the pro CHOICE "movement".
Rosalie is not pro-life and IMHO is such a fake that she doesn't even know how to do an even mildly convincing pretense of being pro-life.
She doesn't criticize her pro-abort co-horts when they make fun of the babies and women victimized bythe abortion industry does she?
Her disapproval of the 'disservice' supposedly being done to the pro-life movement by the real prolifers is (um how/why? because pro-lifers make fun of the abortion industry?) is not matched by any criticism of the pro-abort posters no matter what they post.

reply from: faithman

OUCH!!!! 100% proshame so far!!! I guess the other side is to ashamed to vote the anti shame vote.

reply from: scopia19822

"Pro-aborts insist that women do NOT feel any regret from having killed their own babies by abortion... but then whine that the same women have to be spoken to very carefully or else they might become upset... Hmmm, so if the same deception and pro-abortion grooming and influences aren't applied to those women for the rest of their lives THEN they will feel regret or shame, eh? The only way you pro-aborts can pretend there is no such thing as post-abortion regrets is to 'protect' the woman's state of denial, huh? You admit that when she finds out the gruesome truth THEN she will feel grief, right?"
As a post aborted woman I know all to well at how determined the proaborts are to shut us up. They dont want the truth to get out abort coerced/forced abortions, that women were decieved by the abortion clinic staff and not given all information inlcuding other options. So that they may make an informed decision. They see women like us as "traitors" to the sacred cause of the abortion cult. That is why campaigns like "Silent No More" are a very important tool to the prolife community and educating women on the truth of what abortion really is.

reply from: Rosalie

When they post something stupid or shameful, I will definitely speak up. So far they haven't done so. Unlike so many "pro-life" lunatics who post here.
And how am I a fake, liar?
Busted!
Now Rosalie wants to be part of the bm, rml, cm, lib "pro life movement"!
Of course she does, because it's the same as the pro CHOICE "movement".
I have never been pro-life and never will be. The very thought of that is really disgusting.

reply from: Rosalie

That was funny.
It's post-abortIVE. There's a difference. A huge, huge difference.

reply from: carolemarie

There is a difference in feeling shame for an action and having someone else try to shame you.

reply from: faithman

What the bortheads, and the false pro-lifers do not understand, is that there is more to life than this physical world, and our physical bodies. Our bodies are merely the containers of the precious substance Called life. Life has to have that container to express itself in the natural world. Even if the container is flawed, it still makes it possible for the miracle of life to be expressed. Our common value is not found in the container, but what is contained. The life of a womb child is equal to the life contained in all of us. The only legitimate breaking of this container, is if it has the compunction to smash other containers without cause. When you take way the ability to express life, you loose the great privilege to express your own. Evil aggression must be subdued, or no container can have any security from unjust breakage. To take away the possibility of this wonderful spark of life to be expressed, makes this world a darker place, and the rest of us containers a little more impoverished, and alone. Though the womb child is a small container, it does not lessen the value of the life it contains. If fellow containers do not value the life of the womb child container, then they have placed their personhood container in great jeopardy. Anyone who does not see that womb children are fellow human containers, containing life of equal value to their own, is a self destructive fool, drunk on the power to kill, and must be stopped for the sake of the rest of us life containers. It is the life in us that makes us equal, not our degree of ability to express it.

reply from: yoda

And tea, don't forget the tea. You haters always forget something.

reply from: yoda

Busted!
Now Rosalie wants to be part of the bm, rml, cm, lib "pro life movement"!
Of course she does, because it's the same as the pro CHOICE "movement".
Hey, you can tell that Rosalie is very, very concerned about whether the prolife movement "does good"...... you know she wants only the best for us!

reply from: yoda

And of course, that state of affairs seem perfectly "normal" to anyone who doesn't feel any shame or guilt over killing their own kids, so they think that everyone else ought to be that way, and feel no shame or guilt.

reply from: yoda

Hmmm.......... the poll is running 100% "pro-shame" so far....... hmmmm

reply from: BossMomma

Busted!
Now Rosalie wants to be part of the bm, rml, cm, lib "pro life movement"!
Of course she does, because it's the same as the pro CHOICE "movement".
Rosalie is not pro-life and IMHO is such a fake that she doesn't even know how to do an even mildly convincing pretense of being pro-life.
She doesn't criticize her pro-abort co-horts when they make fun of the babies and women victimized bythe abortion industry does she?
Her disapproval of the 'disservice' supposedly being done to the pro-life movement by the real prolifers is (um how/why? because pro-lifers make fun of the abortion industry?) is not matched by any criticism of the pro-abort posters no matter what they post.
Rosalie is pro-choice dude, she sees nothing wrong with abortion.

reply from: Rosalie

I'm so glad you exactly know what Rosalie thinks and wants!
Your not-so-secret desire to speak and decide for others is showing. A lot.
Correction: I see nothing wrong with abortion if that's what the woman wants, if that's her free, informed decision.
Being forced to abort is just as terrible as being forced to continue the pregnancy.

reply from: scopia19822

"That was funny.
It's post-abortIVE. There's a difference. A huge, huge difference."
THank you for the grammar correction. Sometimes when one has a sick child to attend to, we do those stupid typos.

reply from: nancyu

Weeeellllll let me think. Does being ashamed mean I would have to give up my whore shoes, and moto scooter?

reply from: BossMomma

You ain't kidding, both my older kids are in bed, Rowynn has an ear infection and Tristan has Strep throat. I was in the ER half the night when Rowynn spiked a 104.8 degree fever, scared the shyte out of me.

reply from: faithman

HHHHMMMMM not really. Evil doers should feel it, and we should have enough compassion to help them get there... 2 Corinthians 7: 8-11

reply from: nancyu

I'm so glad you exactly know what Rosalie thinks and wants!
Your not-so-secret desire to speak and decide for others is showing. A lot.
Correction: I see nothing wrong with abortion if that's what the woman wants, if that's her free, informed decision.
Being forced to abort is just as terrible as being forced to continue the pregnancy.
Why? If there is nothing wrong with abortion what difference does it make who makes the decision?

reply from: faithman

You ain't kidding, both my older kids are in bed, Rowynn has an ear infection and Tristan has Strep throat. I was in the ER half the night when Rowynn spiked a 104.8 degree fever, scared the shyte out of me.
To bad daddy dearest wasn't there to hold your hand. But of course holding hands with a pro-death sperm doner might get a little sticky..

reply from: yoda

Can someone make you feel ashamed when you don't think you have anything to be ashamed of? Of course NOT!!
Shame is an INTERNAL emotion, it cannot be imposed from outside. You are just as wrong about that as you are in saying that there is a "difference" between the unborn and the born. You are simply an apologist for the proaborts, you want them to "feel good" about their abortions.
And tell me this: How does putting their photo on the web "shame" anyone if they're not ashamed for it to be known that they were there?

reply from: yoda

Absolutely. And no more leather mini-skirts or fish net blouses, either!

reply from: faithman

Absolutely. And no more leather mini-skirts or fish net blouses, either!
HATERS!!!!!! [just thought I would save farty some time, cm can post her own hate, she does it sssssssooooo well.]

reply from: Rosalie

You have spent more place in this place than I have so it's probably natural that you take every single thing a pro-choicer says as an attack but sometimes it just isn't so.
Because only the woman is entitled to make decisions about her reproductive choices and she should always be able to make her decisions freely and without coercion.
Are you stupid?

reply from: faithman

You have spent more place in this place than I have so it's probably natural that you take every single thing a pro-choicer says as an attack but sometimes it just isn't so.
Because only the woman is entitled to make decisions about her reproductive choices and she should always be able to make her decisions freely and without coercion.
Are you stupid?
[spam snack!!!]What the bortheads, and the false pro-lifers do not understand, is that there is more to life than this physical world, and our physical bodies. Our bodies are merely the containers of the precious substance Called life. Life has to have that container to express itself in the natural world. Even if the container is flawed, it still makes it possible for the miracle of life to be expressed. Our common value is not found in the container, but what is contained. The life of a womb child is equal to the life contained in all of us. The only legitimate breaking of this container, is if it has the compunction to smash other containers without cause. When you take way the ability to express life, you loose the great privilege to express your own. Evil aggression must be subdued, or no container can have any security from unjust breakage. To take away the possibility of this wonderful spark of life to be expressed, makes this world a darker place, and the rest of us containers a little more impoverished, and alone. Though the womb child is a small container, it does not lessen the value of the life it contains. If fellow containers do not value the life of the womb child container, then they have placed their personhood container in great jeopardy. Anyone who does not see that womb children are fellow human containers, containing life of equal value to their own, is a self destructive fool, drunk on the power to kill, and must be stopped for the sake of the rest of us life containers. It is the life in us that makes us equal, not our degree of ability to express it.

reply from: nancyu

Absolutely. And no more leather mini-skirts or fish net blouses, either!
Darn.

reply from: faithman

Absolutely. And no more leather mini-skirts or fish net blouses, either!
Darn.
Sock mending again are we? Gotta keep them pupets in shape!!!

reply from: nancyu

YEAH!!!! you ole shame monger you!!!!!!!!! Shame on you for advocating shame!!! We should all call you shameful names and advocate that you be shamed into stop shameing the shameless.
YEAH!!!!

reply from: faithman

YEAH!!!! you ole shame monger you!!!!!!!!! Shame on you for advocating shame!!! We should all call you shameful names and advocate that you be shamed into stop shameing the shameless.
YEAH!!!! PASS OUT THE PITCH FORKS. AND DON'T BE LATE FOR MOB INSTRUCTIONS!!!! [torches optional]

reply from: nancyu

You have spent more place in this place than I have so it's probably natural that you take every single thing a pro-choicer says as an attack but sometimes it just isn't so.
Because only the woman is entitled to make decisions about her reproductive choices and she should always be able to make her decisions freely and without coercion.
Are you stupid?
No I'm not stupid! And stop trying to shame me! (I voted against it you know)
You hateful hatey hater.

reply from: Banned Member

http://www.s9.com/images/portraits/31093_Varney-Jim.jpg

reply from: yoda

Ain't it awful?
Some people actually think that killing a baby is worse than shaming someone! Can you imagine???
Why, nothing is worse than shaming someone who has just killed their baby, is it? Isn't that worse than capital punishment? It's cruel and unusual punishment, isn't it?

reply from: yoda

Good one......... ole Jim Varney......

reply from: yoda

bump for carole and vern....... still waiting to learn how we can "shame" anyone unjustly if they are not ashamed of what they are doing.....

reply from: faithman

know what i mean.... He went to camp to didn't he? Me thinks he would have ran stinky britches away from camp as well...

reply from: yoda

bump to ask why your photo on the web would cause you "shame" if you didn't already feel ashamed of what the photo showed you doing.....

reply from: Teresa18

Shame is a good thing. I would say our conscience can guide us through established morality established via religion and/or via guardians/individually. We feel the shame because we realize that what we did does not match up with what we consider to be good, moral behavior.
If someone does something wrong and doesn't realize it, there is a moral responsiblity to tell them the truth - that they did something wrong. It is important to feel the shame from the realization that a code of morality was violated. If they are sorry, I would not continue to thrust their wrongdoing in their face. Instead, I would speak of repentance before Christ and atonement for wrongs.

reply from: Teresa18

If you honestly believe they are doing a "disservice" to the pro-life movement, and you want the pro-life movement to fail, why tell them that? Why not allow them to go on and harm the movement that you find disgusting?

reply from: Rosalie

If you honestly believe they are doing a "disservice" to the pro-life movement, and you want the pro-life movement to fail, why tell them that? Why not allow them to go on and harm the movement that you find disgusting?
Why not? It's not like they will think about what I said and stop. I thought that was clear.

reply from: scopia19822

"bump to ask why your photo on the web would cause you "shame" if you didn't already feel ashamed of what the photo showed you doing..."
I dont like having my pic taking as Im not very photogenic.

reply from: carolemarie

Because you are simply trying to hurt someone. Who the heck are you to try to inflict pain on someone?
You post the picture, but you don't know the back story.

reply from: 4given

Hey, if that is what YOU believe, then why don't YOU mind YOUR own business and allow Yodavater to express his own feelings, eh?
Now to answer your question:
ALL sociopaths would love it if everybody else would 'mind their own' business while they BRUTALLY KILLED their innocent victims.
But in a civilized society we don't allow the desire of those who commit fatal acts of violence (or even non-fatal acts of violence for that matter) to be used to chastise us into 'minding our own business'.
The thing is there ARE people who cannot be 'made to' feel guilt over anything they choose to do, even something as vile and cruel as killing an innocent baby.
Such people are sociopathic. So in their case it doesn't really matter one bit if somebody else is trying to make them feel guilt - they simply won't care.
Are you so naive that you believe such sociopaths actually feel hurt or ashamed when they are called killers? They ARE killers BECAUSE they totally lack empathy for heir victims!
Now I am not saying that all women who have abortions are sociopathic, many have been lied to and/or coerced to abort. To that sort of woman it might cause them some hurt, shame, or embarrassment to be called a killer... IF they were still defending what they did and excusing it in any way.
Pro-aborts insist that women do NOT feel any regret from having killed their own babies by abortion... but then whine that the same women have to be spoken to very carefully or else they might become upset... Hmmm, so if the same deception and pro-abortion grooming and influences aren't applied to those women for the rest of their lives THEN they will feel regret or shame, eh? The only way you pro-aborts can pretend there is no such thing as post-abortion regrets is to 'protect' the woman's state of denial, huh? You admit that when she finds out the gruesome truth THEN she will feel grief, right? Well said.

reply from: 4given

Oh dear. I believe I just answered in a different thread almost the same way.

reply from: Teresa18

How do you know? Why would you wish to make any comments that could help pro-life?

reply from: yoda

This is absolutely worth repeating:

reply from: yoda

There you go, trying to be logical with an illogical proabort... shame on you!

reply from: yoda

Don't feel lonesome. But in that case, it wouldn't matter to you where you pic was taken.

reply from: yoda

That is one of your biggest lies. I am trying to prevent the slaughter of an innocent unborn baby.
The "pain" of a guilty conscience is a very small price to pay to open someone's eyes to the horror they are about to commit against an innocent victim. For you to compare that tiny pin prick on one's conscience against the horror of tearing a baby limb from limb is absolutely despicable to me, and I am disgusted that anyone calling themselves prolife would do that.
And the "back story" does not EVER justify killing a totally INNOCENT VICTIM who had nothing to do with the "back story"!
How on earth could you ever even suggest that?

reply from: yoda

Well, you know what the say about "great minds".........

reply from: GodsLaw4Us2Live

Shame and pain are our friends and allies that keep us from destructive behavior, damage and/or death. Pain and shame are unpleasant, but they sure are needed and they are our friend!
When a person puts his hand on the hot stove he feels pain. It is the body's alert system to warn that serious damage is going on. We need to respond to the pain signal.
God gave us both physical pain (to guard against physical damage) and mental Pain (to guard against inappropriate damaging behavior).
Our conscience was given to us so we would feel guilt when we harm or mistreat another human being. Without a painful conscience, we would be like the man with leprosy who left his unfeeling hand on the hot stove until irreparable damage occurred. A cold unfeeling human being may not give a hoot if he takes advantage of others and leaves a widow and her child starving in the street, for example.
The Bible highlights how important it is to have a conscience that works; one that pains us when we have done wrong to others. The Bible says a person who has no conscience is like a person whose nerve endings have been seared by a hot iron. Such a person has no hope for eternal life, they are a hopeless lost cause, because life is about serving, loving and caring for others.
Our conscience, like our nerve pain, leads us away from making wrong decisions and choices that cause damage to others and ourselves.
Who are the two really stupid people who said shame is never appropriate. God created shame to keep us from straying. Shame, when one has done wrong, is good, ALWAYS.

reply from: nancyu

I think this is an excellent post.

reply from: GodsLaw4Us2Live

I think this is an excellent post.
Thank-you! I really appreciate your comment.
I believe God is the Potter, and we are the clay. God is about the business of molding us into a vessel useful for service. We are the product. Since God is Love, and love is the greatest attribute, the one that really counts, God is molding us into loving sons of God.
The whole goal is summed up in this: You shall love God, and you shall love your neighbor.
We are to walk in Jesus' footsteps. He is the example. We are to bend down and wash our brother's feet; to serve others. It is more blessed to give than to receive. God is looking to give us a heart of flesh, to cause us to love and care for others.
Paul said love was everything. If we don't love, we are nothing.
Our conscience guides us and tells us when we are failing to love our neighbor. A conscience and shame may be the greatest gift God gives us (the same as the gift of the Holy Spirit?) to guide us into all truth. Is the Holy Spirit the same as a strong conscience? Maybe.

reply from: yoda

Excellent analogy.
Mmm.... that would be carole and farismear.

reply from: 4given

I agree with the above understanding. Good post.

reply from: faithman

I think this is an excellent post.
Thank-you! I really appreciate your comment.
I believe God is the Potter, and we are the clay. God is about the business of molding us into a vessel useful for service. We are the product. Since God is Love, and love is the greatest attribute, the one that really counts, God is molding us into loving sons of God.
The whole goal is summed up in this: You shall love God, and you shall love your neighbor.
We are to walk in Jesus' footsteps. He is the example. We are to bend down and wash our brother's feet; to serve others. It is more blessed to give than to receive. God is looking to give us a heart of flesh, to cause us to love and care for others.
Paul said love was everything. If we don't love, we are nothing.
Our conscience guides us and tells us when we are failing to love our neighbor. A conscience and shame may be the greatest gift God gives us (the same as the gift of the Holy Spirit?) to guide us into all truth. Is the Holy Spirit the same as a strong conscience? Maybe.
John 16:7-11

reply from: carolemarie

You seem to not get this Yoda.
The woman has already had the abortion. You are posting her picture after the fact. It can't save her baby! The only reason to post her picture is to punish her for aborting and hope that other women will be intimidated by that fact and not come to that clinic.
It is being cruel and vindictive. You get all outraged over a gift bag that has a mug of tea in it (along with the bible, post-abortion stuff...) because you hate the idea of being kind.
I find that appalling

reply from: yoda

My, you are such a hater, carolemarie. You really should get therapy.
No, I take the photos BEFORE the abortion, and that is all most of them know. Most of them don't even bother to inquire what I do with the photos.
But even if they do know, that is how I plant a seed to prevent the NEXT abortion, because some of them might have several, even THREE abortions, who knows?
But yes, some (at least one) woman has been "intimidated" and did not come to the clinic, and her baby lived. You hate that, don't you?
Yes, saving babies is "cruel and vindictive". Get used to it.

reply from: carolemarie

I object to the METHOD you are using, not one saved baby.
The ends do not justify the means...
So out of all the things that people have done, the best you can come up with is filming women going into the abortion clinic and posting the picures on your website?
Are you saying you post the pictures of women who don't have abortions? If they change their mind you post the picture anyways???? That is even worse...

reply from: yoda

Who cares what you object to?
"People have done"? You're asking me to judge other people's efforts? Well, IMO the LEAST EFFECTIVE way to stop abortion is to give them tea and chocolate after their abortion.

Umm..... we don't get a list of who got aborted, so I don't put any captions on the photos anymore. And they don't tell us who "changes their minds", so I have no way of knowing. I don't know what they do once they go into that door, all I know is that they did go through it. And that's all the photos show.
Got any more smears to throw at me? Do I get a chocolate now? How about some of that "love" you use to get people to change their minds? Aren't you going to shower me with love to get me to change my mind?

reply from: ChristianLott2

pro abort. you are nothing but a pro abort.

reply from: yoda

And a HATEFUL one at that! Where is all that "love" she says we ought to use on those who disagree with us?

reply from: ChristianLott2

I hope you shame them right into consciousness, yv. Make them feel like a real movie star with lights flashing all around them. Disgusting.
Chocolates and tea? You're a real jerk for that carole. A real jerk. Why don't you just give it to em before their abortions so they can share it with the butchers inside.

reply from: yoda

I've been doing my best to shame them, but I'm afraid they have no shame in them. Hate yes, shame no.

reply from: ChristianLott2

Because they really probably already know what they're doing. They know. Lucky they have carole to pat them on their backs and give them some comfort. God knows their baby so no comfort at the end of the razor tipped suction hose.

reply from: micah

People like you almost make me want to get an abortion.

reply from: yoda

Yeah, they get their babies sucked out of them with a vacuum cleaner hose, so they need something to fill that void.

reply from: micah

But does he care?

reply from: yoda

You have no idea how glad I am to see you say that.
Now we know that you transfer your feelings about me to a hatred for your very own unborn baby.
What kind of person would do that? What kind of animal would kill their own baby just because they were mad at me?

reply from: carolemarie

I am not mean to you Yoda, I just disagree that shaming women is a useful prolife tactic.
It is being a bully.

reply from: ChristianLott2

My God cares. And He will get even I assure you

reply from: ChristianLott2

Yeah, big mean bully trying to stop a murder! Shame on you yoda!
Just give em some candy after they butcher an innocent baby.

reply from: yoda

Yes, you are very mean to me, you are hateful to me, and you are trying to bully me and SHAME ME into stopping my photography.
You are not showing me any love or kindness or patience, like you claim we ought to use to win over those who disagree with us about killing babies.
Well it won't work. You can't shame me because I'm not ashamed of what I am doing. I am proud of it, and you can't change that.

reply from: ChristianLott2

Yes, you are very mean to me, you are hateful to me, and you are trying to bully me and SHAME ME into stopping my photography.
You are not showing me any love or kindness or patience, like you claim we ought to use to win over those who disagree with us about killing babies.
Well it won't work. You can't shame me because I'm not ashamed of what I am doing. I am proud of it, and you can't change that.
I'm proud of you too yoda. It takes a lot of guts and a lot of insight to see through all the lies.
This is really the one thing I disagreed with Alan Keyes about.
Way to go yv!

reply from: micah

My god will send anyone who doesn't favor abortion to hell. He might not exist, but do you really want to take that chance?
My God cares. And He will get even I assure you

reply from: micah

I meant it as a figure of speech, dude. I've never had an abortion, and probably will never get one. At the same time, I just find it funny that you think you would actually intimidate me out of getting an abortion if I wanted one.
You have no idea how glad I am to see you say that.
Now we know that you transfer your feelings about me to a hatred for your very own unborn baby.
What kind of person would do that? What kind of animal would kill their own baby just because they were mad at me?

reply from: ChristianLott2

Why do keep bringing up god? Are you religious or something?

reply from: ChristianLott2

We know. People say that type of crap all the time. It's old, but he still made you look silly for saying it.

reply from: micah

I find the connection between the God of the bible and pro-life to be interesting, that's all.
Why do keep bringing up god? Are you religious or something?

reply from: ChristianLott2

I don't. I'm actually offended by it. There are too many pro abort 'christians' to make any reference to anything religious ever seem legitimate.
If you think abortion is wrong, say so. If you think Christ is the way - you need to be more specific (and you need to take it to another forum).

reply from: micah

Ah, I see. People on here say such crazy things you never know when they're serious or not, so maybe I can understand. There was one guy who wanted to lock women up in a basement to force her to have a baby.
We know. People say that type of crap all the time. It's old, but he still made you look silly for saying it.

reply from: micah

Offended? Is this your attempt at humor? Aren't you the guy who wanted to lock a woman in your basement?

reply from: ChristianLott2

Offended? Is this your attempt at humor? Aren't you the guy who wanted to lock a woman in your basement?
We don't have basements in New Orleans. And no, she was already pregnant so that wouldn't be forcing her to have a baby, it would be preventing her from murdering the babies she already was having.
Yeah, I'm offended when I'm holding up a sign that says "abortion is murder" and someone else has a sign that says "jesuz savez".
Let's just agree on one thing and then we'll work on the others if someone feels that's important. Understand now?

reply from: yoda

Getting an abortion is NOT a "figure of speech". It is KILLING A BABY, not just any baby but YOUR BABY.
And you implied that you might kill your own baby because you were angry with me. That speaks volumes for your character.
And yes, I'd intimidate you out of killing your baby if I got half a chance. Count on it. Your baby's life has much more moral value than your "free choice to kill" in my book.

reply from: yoda

Locking a woman up in a basement will NOT "force her to have a baby", unless you also rape her while she's locked up. If she's already pregnant, she's already got a baby, and the only uncertainty is whether she will deliver it dead or alive.

reply from: Rosalie

You said you would be willing to abuse her to prevent her from aborting. That is not what a normal person does. This is something a psychopath does.

reply from: Rosalie

Too bad. You don't care about offending others so why should anyone take your feelings into consideration?

reply from: yoda

Hmmm........ 14-2 that shame is a good thing.... I'll bet the two who said it was a bad thing are proaborts.....

reply from: faithman

You said you would be willing to abuse her to prevent her from aborting. That is not what a normal person does. This is something a psychopath does.
What the bortheads, and the false pro-lifers do not understand, is that there is more to life than this physical world, and our physical bodies. Our bodies are merely the containers of the precious substance Called life. Life has to have that container to express itself in the natural world. Even if the container is flawed, it still makes it possible for the miracle of life to be expressed. Our common value is not found in the container, but what is contained. The life of a womb child is equal to the life contained in all of us. The only legitimate breaking of this container, is if it has the compunction to smash other containers without cause. When you take way the ability to express life, you loose the great privilege to express your own. Evil aggression must be subdued, or no container can have any security from unjust breakage. To take away the possibility of this wonderful spark of life to be expressed, makes this world a darker place, and the rest of us containers a little more impoverished, and alone. Though the womb child is a small container, it does not lessen the value of the life it contains. If fellow containers do not value the life of the womb child container, then they have placed their personhood container in great jeopardy. Anyone who does not see that womb children are fellow human containers, containing life of equal value to their own, is a self destructive fool, drunk on the power to kill, and must be stopped for the sake of the rest of us life containers. It is the life in us that makes us equal, not our degree of ability to express it.

reply from: ChristianLott2

Huh? I said no such thing. If you're counting the restraint as abuse, well - murder as the ultimate abuse.

reply from: ChristianLott2

Don't. You never have. So what?
"Offending" a murderer, right.....

reply from: yoda

Oh yeah, that's much worse than the actual murder.... right....

reply from: LiberalChiRo

I find it strange you're so obsessed with the Christian concept of shame, Yoda. Considering you're an atheist.

reply from: Faramir

I find it strange you're so obsessed with the Christian concept of shame, Yoda. Considering you're an atheist.
He calls himself an "agnostic" and not an atheist, though I have seen a post of his that says he has "no doubt" there is a God, so he's a "theist" at least, and not an agnostic.
But he's very confused about the concept of "shame" and when it's appropriate to be the one trying to cause it, and whether it's necessary to shame the reformed.
Otherwise, we could continually shame him for the sins of his past too.

reply from: faithman

I find it strange you're so obsessed with the Christian concept of shame, Yoda. Considering you're an atheist.
He calls himself an "agnostic" and not an atheist, though I have seen a post of his that says he has "no doubt" there is a God, so he's a "theist" at least, and not an agnostic.
But he's very confused about the concept of "shame" and when it's appropriate to be the one trying to cause it, and whether it's necessary to shame the reformed.
Otherwise, we could continually shame him for the sins of his past too.
I haven't seen him shame the reformed..the false yes, reformed, not a chance, hasn't happened. One is not reformed when they vow to fight equality for the womb child thru personhood.

reply from: yoda

Isn't that what you've been constantly trying to do?
Could have fooled me......

reply from: Rosalie

Huh? I said no such thing. If you're counting the restraint as abuse, well - murder as the ultimate abuse.
Every sane person counts the restraint as abuse. Your exact words were:
(http://www.prolifeamerica.com/fusetalk/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=7&threadid=5588&STARTPAGE=4&FTVAR_FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear)
What the hell is wrong with you? I hope you end up in a mental institution soon because you are clearly a sociopath.

reply from: faithman

Huh? I said no such thing. If you're counting the restraint as abuse, well - murder as the ultimate abuse.
Every sane person counts the restraint as abuse. Your exact words were:
(http://www.prolifeamerica.com/fusetalk/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=7&threadid=5588&STARTPAGE=4&FTVAR_FORUMVIEWTMP=Linear)
What the hell is wrong with you? I hope you end up in a mental institution soon because you are clearly a sociopath.
What the bortheads, and the false pro-lifers do not understand, is that there is more to life than this physical world, and our physical bodies. Our bodies are merely the containers of the precious substance Called life. Life has to have that container to express itself in the natural world. Even if the container is flawed, it still makes it possible for the miracle of life to be expressed. Our common value is not found in the container, but what is contained. The life of a womb child is equal to the life contained in all of us. The only legitimate breaking of this container, is if it has the compunction to smash other containers without cause. When you take way the ability to express life, you loose the great privilege to express your own. Evil aggression must be subdued, or no container can have any security from unjust breakage. To take away the possibility of this wonderful spark of life to be expressed, makes this world a darker place, and the rest of us containers a little more impoverished, and alone. Though the womb child is a small container, it does not lessen the value of the life it contains. If fellow containers do not value the life of the womb child container, then they have placed their personhood container in great jeopardy. Anyone who does not see that womb children are fellow human containers, containing life of equal value to their own, is a self destructive fool, drunk on the power to kill, and must be stopped for the sake of the rest of us life containers. It is the life in us that makes us equal, not our degree of ability to express it.

reply from: yoda

Bump for the haters and the shameless.......
Everyone person of good conscience ought to be able to feel shame.

reply from: faithman

I feel shame for "pro-life" that accepts the insane ramblings of baby killers, just because they hand out chocolates to other baby killers.

reply from: sk1bianca

when i was a baby, i scratched my face with my nails so they had to tie me in a tight wrap. when i was 3 my dad locked me in my room because i wouldn't go to sleep (which i evetually did, after getting bored). when i was 12, i had my polipy removed and they strapped me to a chair so i wouldn't struggle when the doctor stuck the scissors up my nose. when i was 16, my grandparents locked the gate so i wouldn't go out with my stupid "friends". all these were done for my own good. was i abused?

reply from: faithman

According to the killer of 3, probly so.

reply from: scopia19822

"all these were done for my own good. was i abused?"
I wouldnt lock my child in their room that is abuse under law, called false imprisonment. The abortion clinic staff told me they were forcing the issue not only because had they been paid to do the "job" but it was for my "own good" as well.

reply from: yoda

No, all those are examples of "tough love".

reply from: sk1bianca

if dad wouldn't have locked me in my room i would have probably run around the house trashing stuff and hurting myself. so i guess it really was for my own good.
PS. i'm glad i don't live in your country .

reply from: yoda

Bump, because carole has changed her mind, and wants FM to be "ashamed" of "telling lies", even though she doesn't want me to "shame" women for having abortions.
Telling lies is much worse than having abortions, right?

reply from: carolemarie

All sin is equal. There is no such thing as nice sins! God treats all sin the same.
The punishment for lying and the punishment for abortion are the exact same thing. God judges them worthy of death.
They are equally bad.

reply from: ChristianLott2

Where did you hear that lie from?

reply from: micah

Faithman must be tough on sin. Not to go against sin would contradict FaithMan's nature. But while Faithman is just in hating abortion, he is also loving and does this for your own good.

reply from: carolemarie

The penelty for sin is death--that is God's standards. One little lie will send you to hell just like having 3 abortions will.
But God loved us, while we were still sinners and sent Jesus to die to make the payment for our sins.
If you break one part of the law, you break all of it. So in God's eyes you suck as much as I did.
None of us have the right to throw stones, because we were forgiven a great debt by a gracious God. Read the ungrateful servant story in the bible....

reply from: ChristianLott2

rofl
rofl. as they say - whatever makes you feel better..
you really will never get it straight cm.
take the plank from your own eye before you go trying to remove the splinter from mine.

reply from: sk1bianca

if a human judge applied the same penalty to all criminals you would probably think he's insane.
God is not only merciful but also JUST.

reply from: faithman

The biblical ignorance is just astounding. No, it ain't about one little sin. Our very nature at birth is without faith, and the substance of which is sin. That is why Christ said you must be born again. Everything a person who is not born again does is sin. The scripture very clearly states that which is not of faith is sin. The transformation in spirit [being born again] involves the process of death burial and resurection. [Romans 6:1-12]. It is not about what we do, but who we are. What we do is just an example of who we are. Killing babies does not make one a baby killer. The act merely shows what a killer already was in their heart. We have baby killewrs on this forum who have never actually killed womb children, but are still killers in their heart. And we have false pro-lifers who have actually killed, and still at the end of the day, justify killing in their heart. No amount of "good works", or false compassion covers that fact up. As a person speaks, so are they. It is just that some persons intend to not let other persons speak, by killing the pre-born person before they are born. They force death upon those who have no voice to defend themselves. A further evidence of a baby killer in heart, are those who vow to fight personhood because it would bring future baby killers to justice. If ya squock like a killer, and walk like a killer, then..... The walking and squolking like a baby killer does not make you one, you already were, the other is just the evidence.

reply from: micah

When Jesus saved FaithMan, he gave him a new heart, which makes him detest sin. That is why we can tolerate abortion and have abortions, but FaithMan cannot.
The biblical ignorance is just astounding. No, it ain't about one little sin. Our very nature at birth is without faith, and the substance of which is sin. That is why Christ said you must be born again. Everything a person who is not born again does is sin. The scripture very clearly states that which is not of faith is sin. The transformation in spirit [being born again] involves the process of death burial and resurection. [Romans 6:1-12]. It is not about what we do, but who we are. What we do is just an example of who we are. Killing babies does not make one a baby killer. The act merely shows what a killer already was in their heart. We have baby killewrs on this forum who have never actually killed womb children, but are still killers in their heart. And we have false pro-lifers who have actually killed, and still at the end of the day, justify killing in their heart. No amount of "good works", or false compassion covers that fact up. As a person speaks, so are they. It is just that some persons intend to not let other persons speak, by killing the pre-born person before they are born. They force death upon those who have no voice to defend themselves. A further evidence of a baby killer in heart, are those who vow to fight personhood because it would bring future baby killers to justice. If ya squock like a killer, and walk like a killer, then..... The walking and squolking like a baby killer does not make you one, you already were, the other is just the evidence.

reply from: yoda

So, you're speaking for carolemarie too?

reply from: carolemarie

God isn't a human. His standard is being perfect. One sin will break that and the penelty for sin is death. If you take the name of God in vain, you are guilty and under the sentance of death. If you have 1 abortion or shoot down 30 people at the mall, you are guilty and under the sentence of death. All humans are sinners deserving of hell. None of us have anything to brag about...
Mass murderers and those who use the name of God in vain get the same punishment. Death.
God sent Jesus to take our punishment and if we believe in Him we get to go to heaven. If you dont take the pardon by accepting what Jesus did, you go to hell. It is up to you to make your choice.
There will be people in hell who did what humans would consider minor sins. And there will be Saints in heaven who committed mass murder.

reply from: faithman

God isn't a human. His standard is being perfect. One sin will break that and the penelty for sin is death. If you take the name of God in vain, you are guilty and under the sentance of death. If you have 1 abortion or shoot down 30 people at the mall, you are guilty and under the sentence of death. All humans are sinners deserving of hell. None of us have anything to brag about...Mass murderers and those who use the name of God in vain get the same punishment. Death.
God sent Jesus to take our punishment and if we believe in Him we get to go to heaven. If you dont take the pardon by accepting what Jesus did, you go to hell. It is up to you to make your choice.
There will be people in hell who did what humans would consider minor sins. And there will be Saints in heaven who committed mass murder.
...and yet you came here bragging. Bragging about killing 3. and bragging about how you will fight personhood if it means future killers such as yourself would actually meet justice.

reply from: ChristianLott2

then BRAGGING about how many babies she 'saves'. She's the biggest braggart on this forum.

reply from: yoda

No, no, you've got that all wrong..... she changes into her "Farismear" personna before she brags on how many she has saved....

reply from: Faramir

then BRAGGING about how many babies she 'saves'. She's the biggest braggart on this forum.
She has never bragged about her saves.
I have been the one bringing up that she has saved over 700. I asked her privately how many saves she was involved with and I had to twist her arm to get an answer out of her because she is humble and because she gives God all the credit.
I got fed up with faithman, yodavater, and nancyu, and others who so cruelly remind her about THE THREE.
So if you want to keep score, then put the 700 babies she helped save against it.
And if you want to keep score about bragging, you might ask the photogrpaher why he mentions the 1 he alleged saved over and over and over...
She's effective at reaching out to women and saving babies.
Deal with it and don't be so jealous.

reply from: carolemarie

God gets the saves, not me. I am not being humble, that is the truth.
I just pray and offer help- God does the hard work!
If you think about it, you will know that is true. I can't change a heart, who am I that anyone would even listen to me, if it wasn't God drawning them.
God does amazing things if you get out of the way and let Him work.
Yoda would see better results if he would pray and let God work, instead of trying to work on his own power~

reply from: yoda

To show that it does work. How many have you saved?

reply from: yoda

Thank you for your advice.
I think you would get better results if you didn't call babies "fetuses" all the time, and say you'd let one of them die to save a born child anytime, and say the unborn "aren't the same" as born kids, and hide behind the Farismear name, etc., etc.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

That's because the options are so skewed many of us are refusing to vote.

reply from: carolemarie

I am not faramir Yoda, I post under my own screenname only.
I am certainly not Catholic!

reply from: danibp

Should we try to help people avoid feeling ashamed by not being honest with them when they have acted immorally, committed evil acts? Should we try to make them feel okay about what they have done when they have done terrible things? Is feeling good more important than honestly feeling bad that you have done a terrible thing?
No, people should be ashamed. However, some of the people who are the most opposed to abortion are the ones who have experienced it. Why would anyone try to defend themselves. Also, I have not read the rest of the thread.
BTW, I am danib. I lost my login credentials.

reply from: Faramir

lol
Is he going paranoid again?

reply from: carolemarie

There is a difference between feeling ashamed of something, and having someone else try to make you feel ashamed of something.
One is your conscience telling you that you did wrong,
the other is someone trying to make you feel bad for what they consider wrong.

reply from: scopia19822

"There is a difference between feeling ashamed of something, and having someone else try to make you feel ashamed of something.
One is your conscience telling you that you did wrong,
the other is someone trying to make you feel bad for what they consider wrong"
I couldnt have put this thought into better words CM. Im very much ashamed of my abortion, even though I have been told I shouldnt be. I have done a lot in my life to be ashamed for, that Im sorry for and will never do again. However I dont need to constantly be reminded of my past, that is counterproductive to being able to move on with ones life.

reply from: scopia19822

"Lol
Is he going paranoid again?"
Probably so, but who cares. Some people are happy living in their own little world.

reply from: Faramir

Whatever.
I didn't know prolifers like this existed until I came to this crazy place.
I think I understand why I am a "faux lifer." It's probably because I sometimes defend one of their favorite punching bags. Why are YOU one?

reply from: scopia19822

"I think I understand why I am a "faux lifer." It's probably because I sometimes defend one of their favorite punching bags. Why are YOU one"
Because I told Yoda if I caught someone taking my pic without my consent than I would take their camera and smash it. He of course thought it was specifcally directed at hime and told me not try that with him. Of course me being old fashioned think a man who would put his hands on a woman no matter what she may do is a coward and it escalated so now Im a faux lifer. I think the only time I would get "violent" is if someone was taking pics of my son as only a pervert would be going around taking pics of a 5 yr old without parental consent.

reply from: micah

Yoda does have a right to take pictures though, and there is nothing you can do to stop him. He has accepted the risk of a civil judgment in court, so it is doubtful that he will be intimated by harsh language in an online forum.

reply from: scopia19822

"Yoda does have a right to take pictures though, and there is nothing you can do to stop him. He has accepted the risk of a civil judgment in court, so it is doubtful that he will be intimated by harsh language in an online forum."
He can take the pics, but if a woman asked him not too publish them and he does he can be open to legal action. If a woman comes across his site and found her image, she can asked him to remove it, if he fails once again he can be subject to legal actions. Its only a matter of time before hes in court with a suit, so I really dont see the sense on dwelling on it.

reply from: Faramir

So it doesn't matter that you oppose abortion??!!
You are a "faux-lifer" because he thought you might hurt his camera?
I think we need to get the dictionary out and redefine what it means to be prolife.

reply from: scopia19822

"o it doesn't matter that you oppose abortion??!!
You are a "faux-lifer" because he thought you might hurt his camera?
I think we need to get the dictionary out and redefine what it means to be prolife."
And because I defended Carolemarie because I thought the treatment she was recieving is unjust and uncalled for.

reply from: Faramir

Maybe if you kiss his butt, he'll let you back in the club.
Just don't disagree about ANYTHING and you'll be fine.
And take a couple of whacks and carole now and then, just to show that you love the babies.

reply from: scopia19822

"Maybe if you kiss his butt, he'll let you back in the club. "
the thought of that makes me want to wretch! EWW ! I rather be known as a faux lifer or a proabort, because I know the truth of where I stand on these issues and most important God knows. those who continue to call me a probort or a faux lifer are the ones guilty of slander and bearing false witness.

reply from: Faramir

It could also unfortunately be that you are a target because you are post-abortive.
I'm happy to see you are not easily intimidated.

reply from: sk1bianca

i think shame is for one's soul (or conscience) what pain is for the body.
pain is meant to tell us something is wrong. not being able to feel pain is considered to be a serious medical condition. one could get hurt and not even know.
same thing with shame. without shame one wouldn't be able to realize when he did something wrong and would probably keep repeating it, hurting himself and others.
at least, that's my opinion...

reply from: Faramir

I agree with you 100%.
I just don't think it's my business to follow you around trying to catch you doing something wrong, and then broadcast it on the Nightly News, so that I can "shame you."

reply from: yoda

Then you have missed a perfectly good chance. You seem to speak through him, do you tell him what to say?

reply from: yoda

By revealing your presence at the abortion mill?
You think they are entitled to "privacy" as they go to kill their babies, don't you? You wouldn't answer that question before, will you now?

reply from: yoda

Carole says she isn't ashamed of her three.

reply from: yoda

And yet you do dwell on it, over and over an over...... without having a clue as to what you are talking about. I have been "asked" not to publish photos, I have been threatened, I have been attacked. And yet I am still there, week after week, taking them and putting them on the web so that stupid people like you can tell me that I am "in danger of being sued"... over and over and over again..... like some stupid record player playing the same stupid song over and over and over.....

reply from: yoda

Any of you faux-lifers that want to "hurt my camera" will have to go through me first. Are you going to be the first?
By the way, if you approve of her threats to destroy my property, then I guess you also approve of bombing an empty abortion mill, right?
How about that, Mr. Perfect Catholic?

reply from: yoda

And yet, if we "facillitate" that process by posting an uncaptioned photo on the web, we are evil people, according to the faux-lifers.
Even if we save babies that way, we are still evil people. I think that's why they hate my work so much.

reply from: yoda

Whom do you think I "follow around"?
You fit right in to the typical proabort habbit of lying about my work. Some of you proaborts even accuse me of "stalking the clinic". You really have no shame, decency, or conscience, do you?

reply from: nancyu

Whom do you think I "follow around"?
You fit right in to the typical proabort habbit of lying about my work. Some of you proaborts even accuse me of "stalking the clinic". You really have no shame, decency, or conscience, do you?
Why, Yoda I think they are trying to publicly shame you!

reply from: yoda

They have been trying to shame me for days now, but it just won't take!
Apparently, shaming someone is okie dokie if that person is trying to save babies, but not if they are about to kill one.
And they are showing a lot of hate for me too, not the lovey dovey attitute they project towards baby killers.
They talk love, and show hate towards those who sacrifice for the babies.

reply from: nancyu

They have been trying to shame me for days now, but it just won't take!
Apparently, shaming someone is okie dokie if that person is trying to save babies, but not if they are about to kill one.
And they are showing a lot of hate for me too, not the lovey dovey attitute they project towards baby killers.
They talk love, and show hate towards those who sacrifice for the babies.
Hateful bullies, those faux lifers...

reply from: Faramir

Whom do you think I "follow around"?
You fit right in to the typical proabort habbit of lying about my work. Some of you proaborts even accuse me of "stalking the clinic". You really have no shame, decency, or conscience, do you?
Why, Yoda I think they are trying to publicly shame you!
This guy is a little too self-obsessed.
I was not referring to him.
The point was that I should not "out" someone about a sin or fault. If I knew you cheated on your husband and had photos of you at the motel, it would be wrong for me to post them or share them with your neighbors.
I know very well he does not follow women around with his camera and was not referring to that.

reply from: yoda

Cheating on a spouse does not necessarily cause the death of any innocent human beings, does it?
You really don't think that abortion is a serious issue, do you?

reply from: scopia19822

"I have been "asked" not to publish photos,"
You have been asked Yoda ? Do you still do it anyway? If so then you have broken the law. I may sound like a broken record, but if you publish after being "asked" not too, you are breaking the law and subject to civil penalties, if not criminal.

reply from: yoda

How can I say this gently........ you are full of crap. There, that's as gentle as I can be.....
I'm really, really glad you're not on "my side".

reply from: scopia19822

"I'm really, really glad you're not on "my side"."
The feeling is mutual. You are the one that is full of crap, may I suggest some chocolate covered Exlax it may make you feel alot better. Go ahead and take your pics and publish them without consent, these things usually take care of themselves, its only a matter of time before you will be in court with a lawsuit.

reply from: Faramir

I think he's in the right as far as legality is concerned.
But because it's legal, doesn't mean it's right or moral.
He employs evil means to accomplish a good end, but the end does not justify the means, though I cannot say he does so with evil intent, and should assume he has a good intent, though his behaviour on this board speaks volumes about his charachter, or mostly lack thereof.

reply from: scopia19822

"I think he's in the right as far as legality is concerned."
Hes only partially right, legally he can take the pics and keep them, however if a he were to take a pic of me and I told him not to publish it and he did anyway, Im well within my rights to sue him. If he takes it without my knowledge and posts on his website and I come across it, I have every legal right to ask him to remove my image, he fails to do so I can sue him. Any person who publishes pics after being "asked"
not too is suspect in moral character.

reply from: micah

Actually, you could sue him even he did agree to take them. If you weren't getting an abortion, you could sue for libel. You might be able to sue under HIPPA or even get a criminal charge. However, yoda is willing to take on these risks, so he has a right to take pictures and do what he wants with them.

reply from: scopia19822

"Actually, you could sue him even he did agree to take them. If you weren't getting an abortion, you could sue for libel. You might be able to sue under HIPPA or even get a criminal charge. However, yoda is willing to take on these risks, so he has a right to take pictures and do what he wants with them."
He takes the risks and he has the legal right to take the pics, but thats all. He has no right to publish them without consent.

reply from: yoda

Like I said before, you are full of crap. And so is your proabort buddy.
The proof is in the results of such photos being published for the last 15 years, with NO lawsuits being filed.
Not everyone is as full of crap as you are.

reply from: scopia19822

"The proof is in the results of such photos being published for the last 15 years, with NO lawsuits being filed.
Not everyone is as full of crap as you are."
Just because you havent been sued doesnt mean you cant or want be.

reply from: Faramir

I don't see why some keep pushing the idea it's "illegal" and he'll get sued, etc.
It's IMMORAL but it's not illegal.

reply from: yoda

Good question.
Why DO you keep on harping about that, scarpia?

reply from: scopia19822

"I don't see why some keep pushing the idea it's "illegal" and he'll get sued, etc.
It's IMMORAL but it's not illegal."
If a person takes a pic of me without my consent and publishes it without my knowledge on a website I have a legal right to ask that it may be removed as its my image being used. By law they are required to do so. If I tell them not to publish my pic and they do it anyway I have the legal right to sue them. It would be seen as invasion of my privacy, the only way he could legally get around that is if the faces were blurred out.

reply from: scopia19822

"Good question.
Why DO you keep on harping about that, scarpia?"
Because while the pic taking may legal, the publishing of them may not be if permission isnt granted for you to that. What your are doing is a high tech lynching.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

It's not illegal to post them until the person sees the picture, and then only if they say "take it down". The rights defer to the photographer initially.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

And yet you do dwell on it, over and over an over...... without having a clue as to what you are talking about. I have been "asked" not to publish photos, I have been threatened, I have been attacked. And yet I am still there, week after week, taking them and putting them on the web so that stupid people like you can tell me that I am "in danger of being sued"... over and over and over again..... like some stupid record player playing the same stupid song over and over and over.....
If you have been asked in any way shape or form not to publish a photo of someone and done so anyway, you are breaking the law.

reply from: Faramir

Not if it can get by as "journalism."
That's how Neil Horsley justifies what he does.

reply from: scopia19822

Not if it can get by as "journalism."
That's how Neil Horsley justifies what he does."
Both are full of it.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

Not if it can get by as "journalism."
That's how Neil Horsley justifies what he does.
Again, he'd have to present solid proof; just using journalism as an excuse to break the law wouldn't pass in any sensible courtroom.

reply from: yoda

This is really kind of amusing, when you think of it. With all the radical, foaming at the mouth proaborts out there looking for some way to injure any prolife effort, you don't have the intelligence to figure out that if there was any legal way to impede the use of photography it would have been done long ago. People with much more money, and much more intelligence than you have looked the issue over for years, and have given up on using the law to protect the privacy of abortion bound parents. Obviously, you want to try to out do them with much less money and much less intelligence.


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