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Thank you prodeath skanc

by: faithman

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg This beautiful presentation of womb life is brought to you by lowlifeia. Ain't it great when you can get the borties to do your work for you?!!!!!!!!!

reply from: faithman

Poke a snake long enough they will generally bite themselves.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

You can't use that, you know. You don't have copyright.

reply from: faithman

Didn't see a mark on it. SSSSSOOOOO who holds copyright?

reply from: sander

She probably stole it from someone else.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

The photoshopping is mine, but the picture I ripped off google images.

reply from: AshMarie88

Looks like a person to me. Good job for seeing our side! ;-)

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Still pro-choice, sorry.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

She can prove she made the image with computer files. She created it originally so SHE instantly holds the copyright, by law. ANY image created by anyone is instantly THEIRS and is instantly copyrighted by law. I learned all about copyright law as an art student, especially in the graphic design world. We face *****s like you every day fakeman, who think they can just take anything they see on the internet. It's not true. It's illegal, and if she can prove it, you can be fined or go to jail.
On top of that, the actual images of the Embryos that you guys used probably BELONG to someone else, so unless you bought the rights to use those images, you're BOTH violating copyright law if you claim the photos as your own OR if you use them to make money.

reply from: faithman

She probably stole it from someone else.
She is a good thief. I just love it !!!!! Its SSSSSOOOOOOOO purty!!!!!!http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg

reply from: LiberalChiRo

She probably stole it from someone else.
She is a good thief. I just love it !!!!! Its SSSSSOOOOOOOO purty!!!!!!http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg
Where did you get the image of the embryo from in YOUR poster? Did you buy the rights to it, do you own the right to distribute it?

reply from: faithman

Before you go getting all puffy, go to life issues who owns the copyright on my image, and ask them if I have permission to use it. If you notice, the image very clearly displays the life issues copy right. All I have done with lowlifeias image is post an address to view it. I have also given her credit with every post. If anyone has violated copy right it is her.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Well, I admit the picture's not mine, but I'm pretty sure the one faithman uses in his signs isn't his either. And I don't plan on claiming it as my photo or using it to make money, so all that's on faithman, who seems interested in doing that.

reply from: faithman

She probably stole it from someone else.
She is a good thief. I just love it !!!!! Its SSSSSOOOOOOOO purty!!!!!!http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg
Where did you get the image of the embryo from in YOUR poster? Did you buy the rights to it, do you own the right to distribute it?
Affirmative on both.

reply from: sander

Before you go getting all puffy, go to life issues who owns the copyright on my image, and ask them if I have permission to use it. If you notice, the image very clearly displays the life issues copy right. All I have done with lowlifeias image is post an address to view it. I have also given her credit with every post. If anyone has violated copy right it is her.

reply from: nancyu

Still pro-choice, sorry.
Who cares what you call yourself. You did good work. (Liberal and CM, and farimore call themselves pro life, for all the good it does)

reply from: LiberalChiRo

He PMed me actually, so no harm done.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Before you go getting all puffy, go to life issues who owns the copyright on my image, and ask them if I have permission to use it. If you notice, the image very clearly displays the life issues copy right. All I have done with lowlifeias image is post an address to view it. I have also given her credit with every post. If anyone has violated copy right it is her.
It seems like half the posts you make here are quoting faithman and regurgitating his crap. You also seem willing to defend even the most vile of his actions. Are you his sockpuppet or his mistress? He claims you're not his wife, so you must be some kind of "home-wrecker".

reply from: faithman

Aint it just PPPPPPPUUUUUURRRRRRTTTTTYYYYY??????!!!! http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg I just love it!!!!!! The little heart thang is such a sweet touch!!!!! HMMMM!!!! HHHHHMMMHMMM!!!! HHHHMMM!!!! I love it when God gets the devil to do my work!!!!

reply from: faithman

Before you go getting all puffy, go to life issues who owns the copyright on my image, and ask them if I have permission to use it. If you notice, the image very clearly displays the life issues copy right. All I have done with lowlifeias image is post an address to view it. I have also given her credit with every post. If anyone has violated copy right it is her.
It seems like half the posts you make here are quoting faithman and regurgitating his crap. You also seem willing to defend even the most vile of his actions. Are you his sockpuppet or his mistress? He claims you're not his wife, so you must be some kind of "home-wrecker".
Poor little dear. Feeling left out? I would be more than glad to add you to my hen house. Keep laying eggs like http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg and you can be the head hen.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

I have more self-respect than that, F-boy. Go sleep with your whore.

reply from: sander

You don't have an ounce of self respect, self worship, yes.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Well I wouldn't worship someone I don't respect...

reply from: churchmouse

Your pro-death you mean lolita.
You call someone a homewrecker and you are pro-death for the unborn child?
LOL
Self respect? You certainly have no respect for the life in the womb.
How old did you say you were? 17 ?

reply from: LolitaOlivia

You see, that should say "You're pro-death, you mean, Lolita." Learn how to write.
Next, I'm not "pro-death" and to say that is just silly. I support a woman's right to choose to have an abortion, but I do not support killing born people and I certainly don't support death as a concept.
How are those two things related, may I ask?
Why would those be related? I don't live in a womb.
Almost 21.

reply from: nancyu

Well, I admit the picture's not mine, but I'm pretty sure the one faithman uses in his signs isn't his either. And I don't plan on claiming it as my photo or using it to make money, so all that's on faithman, who seems interested in doing that.
I really do love the image lolita. It's very sweet, (I set it as my desktop background.)
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg

reply from: LolitaOlivia

^Plaster it all over your room for all I care..

reply from: faithman

Check this out!!!!!!! It is SSSSSSOOOOOO PPPPPUUUUUURRRRRDDDDDEEEEE!!!!
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg

reply from: faithman

Well, I admit the picture's not mine, but I'm pretty sure the one faithman uses in his signs isn't his either. And I don't plan on claiming it as my photo or using it to make money, so all that's on faithman, who seems interested in doing that.
I have never claimed the image as "my own", and have always given credit to life issues who holds copright. Their copyright mark is on it as was a part of our agreemnet for me using it. I have never used "IAAP" for making money. Every dime I have ever gotten from folks who have donated goes directly into production and distribution. I do not recieve one penny from IAAP for personal use. Never happened, and never will. I have freely given hundreds of thousands of cards away, as well as posters. Many of which were given away thru this forum as more than a few people can testify to. I have also informed people as to how they can get copyright permission, and produce the material themselves. If I were interested in making money, I would never have done any of those things. I would have tried to maintain control over it, insted of give it away for free. My interest is equiping as many people as I can with material that I know from personal experiance is a very powerful tool in the cause of defending womb life. Some have caught onto that vission, and are now helping us to distribute material, not making money.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Why not give the money you put into it to a charity that helps pregnant women and young children take care of themselves instead of harassing people with your signs?

reply from: faithman

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg
There are already those who do that. besides "harassing" people like you is more fun. Have you seen this?

reply from: faithman

Its SSSSSOOOOOOOOO PUUUUURRRRRRDDDEEEEE
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Yeah, glad you like it, F-boy. Well, maybe glad isn't the right word... you get the picture.

reply from: churchmouse

LolitaOlivia you spin it anyway you want to.......you are pro-abortion. And if you are pro-abortion then you dont believe the unborn in the womb have any rights.
What is it so hard for you to get? Maybe others here think its so cruel to call you that, but I dont care. You cant sit the fence on this. You are what you are, and you are pro-abortion.
Lolita, telll me, is there something wrong with abortion? And if there is, why do you condone the slaughter?
To make the pro-abortion crowd go nuts. Like Crutcher says, "genocide is more palatable when no one but the killer sees it.'
Because those pictures force you to look at the little ones that you give women the right to dismember alive Lolita. You dont want to be reminded that you condone killing do you? You dont want to face it, out of site out of mind.
"Abortion profiteers know that many, if not most, of their customers would fly out the door if they saw beforehand what abortion really is. That's why they would rather them not get that sort of information until after the abortion is over and the money is in the bank." Mark Crutcher

You dont want to see it.......and I certainly can see why.

reply from: faithman

[/L]
Yepper, I got the http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1840/fetuscopysz9.jpg .....and Its SSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOO PPPPPUUUUURRRRRRRDDDDDDEEEEEEE!!!!!! But me thinks you may have some competion in this borty art show......

reply from: faithman

MY MY MY!!!!!! This one is really nice too!!!! HHHHHHHMMMMMMM Which one is best?!!!!! I will have to sleep on it!!!

reply from: faithman

MY MY MY!!!!!! This one is really nice too!!!! HHHHHHHMMMMMMM Which one is best?!!!!! I will have to sleep on it!!!
Did it move you emotionally?
It was a very nice one indeed. I would say they are about even right now.

reply from: 4given

I like yours. It would be nice on a t-shirt.. and there is potential for profit in that.. albeit not often much.. I like it and may buy it.. though my boys aren't into hearts... unless they are ripped apart and spewing blood.. I think an accurate pro-life picture may depict just that- an open wound- a heart ripped out with a fetal image inside.. how I visualize the father's ignored and victimized by the pro-choice/abort movement...

reply from: 4given

Sure.. Are baby elephant's threatened in the womb? If so, I should gather up my quarter quiver and have them to the design boards immediately.. Perhaps I don't question other's integrity because I often fail to realize the lack of standards in others.. Naivety maybe?

reply from: 4given

And I am particularly fond of elephants! So your design works here.. any young human, animal.. species seems to be considered valuable to my children.

reply from: faithman

HHHHHMMMMM what happened to the picture?

reply from: 4given

HHHHHMMMMM what happened to the picture?
Seems to only work with her link.. I don't actually care. And you?

reply from: faithman

HHHHHMMMMM what happened to the picture?
Seems to only work with her link.. I don't actually care. And you?
Not really. It is a nice little illistration that may, or may not be what it says it is. I know IAAP is a little baby human, and a person. I am not trying to trick anybody with doctored illestrations. I am merely making real picture of the truth available.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

I'm not "pro-abortion" because I only support abortion when the woman wants it. If she doesn't want one, I'm against it.
There shouldn't be any abortion because in a perfect world women would only get pregnant when they wanted to have a baby. No, though, I don't think it's "wrong" any more than other things, like meat and fur that take a life. I condone it for the same reasons I condone meat and fur, the priorities of born human beings should come before everything else.
To make the pro-abortion crowd go nuts. Like Crutcher says, "genocide is more palatable when no one but the killer sees it.'
Because those pictures force you to look at the little ones that you give women the right to dismember alive Lolita. You dont want to be reminded that you condone killing do you? You dont want to face it, out of site out of mind.
"Abortion profiteers know that many, if not most, of their customers would fly out the door if they saw beforehand what abortion really is. That's why they would rather them not get that sort of information until after the abortion is over and the money is in the bank." Mark Crutcher

You dont want to see it.......and I certainly can see why.
No, those pictures don't bother me a bit. I've been doing abortion debates for more than four years, you think I haven't seen it all? It's not out of sight out of mind, or whatever. Most Americans eat beef, and I bet pretty much all of them have seen pictures of cows before.
And nice trick, Vexing. Early in the womb you really can't tell the difference between humans and animals.

reply from: churchmouse


LOL You are hilarious.
LMAO
So if slavery were legal......you would feel the same way? How drugs? Infanticide?
And in a perfect world there wouldnt be people like you that think killing a defenseless human child in the womb is ok and whose life is comparable to that of any animal?
I am sure they don't....nothing probably bothers you exept the wrong color of nail polish.
Honey, we are not talking about cows. We are talking about living HUMAN BEINGS.
Earth to lolita...........
Some people like tricks they think its cute. To mock a human in the womb......with a cow.......how sick is that?

reply from: LolitaOlivia

If a woman wanted to make something living in her womb her slave that's her business. I don't see how an unborn is going to do any labor or anything, though. I have no problem with drugs as long as their used safely by willing adults who understand the risks and don't drive or operate weapons. Infanticide is completely different, as born babies aren't inside their mother's body, so whether she wants to kill them is irrelevant.
Yes. My kitty can open doors by herself. My fetus sure can't do that. Why is should one be worth more than the other? Neither are born humans with legal rights.
No, plenty of other things bother me.
Just a few:
1. Cruelty to cats and dogs.
2. Anti-abortion protesters/Faithman/Yodavater
3. Abstinence only sex-ed.
4. The war in Iraq.
5. Rape.
6. Republicans.
7. That pseudo-indie crap they put in ipod commercials.
8. Splenda.
9. Corporations that take American dollars but hire overseas.
10. Anal sex.
11. People who don't know the difference between Elizabeth I and Elizabeth, the Queen Mother.
12. Men who call me "shorty" even though I'm taller than them.
13. Sexual harassment.
14. Mary of Teck
15. People who think Harry Potter books are for little kids.
16. Mascara that makes my eyelashes clump.
17. Foundations companies that don't make a shade light enough for my skin tone.
18. People who say "excuse you" when you bump into them.
19. Poorly researched historical films.
20. Late fees from the library.
But which is smarter, a cow or a fetus? I'm going with the cow.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Hey, F-boy, I made you another picture. This one's more humorous...
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/7503/fetuslollp6.jpg

reply from: sander

Faux prolifers at work, 4Given. You'd think we'd get use to their sickness, but really, that's what seperates the hard hearted (them) from those whose hearts are not made of concrete.

reply from: sander

Kudos and touche coming from a death monger.....evil congratulating evil, what a sickening scene.

reply from: KaylieBee

That's a pretty poorly made sign.
MS paint?

reply from: LolitaOlivia

Department of Motor Vehicles. In America you have to go there to wait in line for hours whenever you renew your license or get new plates or anything like that.

reply from: yoda

IF it did look "completely realistic", then it wouldn't mislead anyone, would it?

reply from: Faramir

So does most of the adult population...
Hey, speak for yourself.

reply from: nancyu

IF it did look "completely realistic", then it wouldn't mislead anyone, would it?
If I look completely realistic as a woman, have surgery and I marry a man without telling him that I used to live as a man, I'm not misleading him, am I?
Good point. Maybe you wouldn't be misleading him, but you would be keeping a secret that he might be upset about if he found out. When you made the elephant fetus image, I was mostly upset with myself for falling for the deception than angry with you for creating it. I admired the artwork nevertheless.

reply from: yoda

Yes, you are, because there is no surgery that will do that.
More importantly, however, is that your question has zero to do with the appearance of an aborted fetus. There is no valid comparison between the two situations.

reply from: churchmouse

Wow I missed that one.
That would be nice Concerned, if you could find it I'd like to read it again.
WHAT??????????????????????
What are you saying here?
Somebody is not operating with a full deck, that is for sure.
You are soemthing else.......pro-choice, my arse. You have no clue Lolita.
Just a few:
You put them over the unborn child. An ant is equal to a little child.
Dont forget me......I'd like to be on your list. I protest, (almost was arrested), I picket and hold up graphic signs with aborted fetus on them.
And where is this taught?
Hate the soldiers do ya?
Agreed
ROFLMAO
Yes you are pro-abortion, that is what the democrats stand on Lolita. LOL
They are not for abstenience only.........jsut open borders, abortion, even partial birth. You fit right in.
That would upset a teenager.
Abortion hasnt made the list but splenda does.
So your a socialist, communist?
LOL
Abortion not on list yet....but hey the Queen got on it.
How cute. But where is abortion?
Abortion?
abortion?
Do you eat cookies and drink milk when you read them?
BEFORE ABORTION..........?
There is other make up honey thats not just Cover Girl.
Abortion?
Oh yes, this is an important one.
Even more important.
Oh honey you are no more pro-life than the man in the moon. No I even think he is pro-life.
In that entire list.......not one given to killing the unborn child. But one given to two people who hate the slaughter.
Your pathetic.

reply from: LolitaOlivia

WHAT??????????????????????
What are you saying here?
Just that abortion is in no way comparable to slavery involving born people.
Somebody is not operating with a full deck, that is for sure.
You are soemthing else.......pro-choice, my arse. You have no clue Lolita.
I am pro-choice. I support a pregnant woman's right to choose what she does.
You put them over the unborn child. An ant is equal to a little child.
Not a born child, no. An ant probably isn't even equal to an unborn child. Bigger animals are, though.
Dont forget me......I'd like to be on your list. I protest, (almost was arrested), I picket and hold up graphic signs with aborted fetus on them.
Yeah, but you're not a "prommie" (to borrow the gaiaonline term) like they are.
And where is this taught?
Most of the red states and even some blue states.
Hate the soldiers do ya?
No, I love our soldiers (my cousin's a soldier). Not crazy about the men that sent them there, though.
Agreed
Good.
ROFLMAO
Yes you are pro-abortion, that is what the democrats stand on Lolita. LOL
They are not for abstenience only.........jsut open borders, abortion, even partial birth. You fit right in.
Lemme guess, you voted Bush, right? Republicans bother me because they think they own the world.
That would upset a teenager.
Most teenagers I know like that kind of music. I hate it because it's fake. Once they start putting you in an ipod commercial, you've sold out. You're just like Britney Spears. Why pretend to be something different? I have no problem with mainstream artists. They're upfront about who and what they are. What I don't like is weak, non-catchy songs that slide up the charts based on their alleged "indie" factor, when in face they're just as processed and studio manufactured as anything by Britney or Paris.
Abortion hasnt made the list but splenda does.
Abortion isn't going to make the list. And Splenda tastes nasty and is made from chemicals.
So your a socialist, communist?
No. I believe we could learn something from some socialist and communist ideas, but governments based solely on those principals don't tend to work out in real life.
LOL
If that's what you're into, go right ahead. I just don't like it.
Abortion not on list yet....but hey the Queen got on it.
No, the Queen doesn't bother me. Just people who don't know enough about her family.
How cute. But where is abortion?
You don't know how annoying that is. I'd still be tall even if I were a guy. It's rude.
Abortion?
Yes, women who get abortions are often sexually harassed by pro-life protesters.
abortion?
I think Mary of Teck was against abortion, actually.
Do you eat cookies and drink milk when you read them?
No, green tea and muffins normally does the trick.
BEFORE ABORTION..........?
Of course. Abortion doesn't give me trouble when I do my make up every morning.
There is other make up honey thats not just Cover Girl.
I would never use Cover Girl products. They test on animals. I don't use anything from a drug store anyway. Too many oils and chemicals.
Abortion?
I wish their mothers had had abortions, sometimes.
Oh yes, this is an important one.
Isn't it just? You ever been in a theater and found yourself screaming at the screen "That didn't happen!" at the top of your lungs?
Even more important.
Those cost me twenty bucks last month.
Oh honey you are no more pro-life than the man in the moon. No I even think he is pro-life.
In that entire list.......not one given to killing the unborn child. But one given to two people who hate the slaughter.
Your pathetic.
It's "You're pathetic." Learn spelling, kthnksbi.
I never said I was pro-life. And of course "killing the unborn child" isn't on the list. That doesn't really bother me.

reply from: yoda

No surgery that will do what? Be specific.
The answer to your question was in the post you took that quote from. Why did you leave that part out? Are you being deliberately deceptive?
Here is what you left out: "Originally posted by: Vexing
If I look completely realistic as a woman, have surgery and I marry a man without telling him that I used to live as a man, I'm not misleading him, am I?"
There is no surgery that will make a man look completely realistic as a woman.

reply from: yoda

So now, looking "revolting" is justification for slaughter......

reply from: cracrat

It's not really any different from any other secret from your past you choose not to share. I would wonder why you would choose not to tell the person you want to spend the rest of your life with about your former maleness, but unless he asks you outright and you lie, no you are not misleading him.

reply from: yoda

If as you say it was "completely realistic", how could you be misleading anyone? What incorrect impression would they get if it was "completely realistic"?
I mean, you're not asking anyone to marry the picture, right?

reply from: yoda

You didn't answer the question. How would people be misled about abortion if the photo was "totally realistic"?
Nope. I'm just answering your question. It was YOUR hypothetical about a "fake photo that was totally realistic", not mine.
Because no one marries a fetus made out of "wax and pain". Being married to someone involves a lot more than images and impressions....

reply from: cracrat

Yes, because you're presenting it as an original Van Gogh, which it is not. If Van Gogh were to copy an Van Gogh (issues of him being dead aside) and sell it, that woud not be misleading the buyer.

reply from: yoda

I will answer your question, and hope against all hope that you will answer mine. Of course it is deception, by definition. Now, for my question (which you never answered): IF such a fake was "totally realistic", how would it mislead anyone ON THE SUBJECT OF ABORTION?
Not really..... you can't use surgery to create feminine characteristics... that takes hormones, over a long period of time. Wouldn't you agree?

reply from: yoda

Are you always this melodramatic, or do you just enjoy hyperbole so much that you must splatter it all over the walls at every opportunity?
And of course, I was right, you didn't answer my question, and probably never will........ when will I ever learn???
Not to mention that I never took exception to the fact that a fake is a deception....... which would've been foolish since that's the DEFINITION of a fake...
Are you trying out for a part in a movie, or what?

reply from: yoda

Ah, now I see your "response", tucked in between your hysterics and histrionics: "It could quite easily deceive (not 'mislead') someone; especially if it is not an accurate depiction of an abortion, regardless of how 'totally realistic' it looks. "
Pretty flimsy response, don't you think? Kinda straining at gnats, aren't ya? Why, you're getting so technical you remind me of myself a little.....
Why not just answer the question as you know I intended it? IF the photo is "accurate", how could it mislead someone?

reply from: yoda

Because you can't be an "accurate woman". If you begin life as a man, you do not have the requisite plumbing.
Oh my, I let you avoid answering MY question again, I must be getting soft...

reply from: yoda

No operation will make you capable of bearing children. No operation will make you anatomically female. Science hasn't figured that one out yet.

reply from: yoda

Not biologically, no. You can't change your DNA, nor can you bear children.
Didn't you already know all this?

reply from: yoda

Yes, "she" is still a woman. Her DNA says so. What does yours say?

reply from: yoda

In what way is it "misleading"?
Does it convey false information? Does it mislead about biology?
In what way is it misleading ON THE SUBJECT OF ABORTION?

reply from: yoda

I edited my question.
Obviously, any "fake" is misleading concerning it's identity, how many times do we have to go over that? And all fakery is unethical and immoral, do we at least agree on that?
I keep asking you the same question, and you keep ignoring my question. So, unless you are willing to respond to it, we have nothing further to discuss.
How does a fake fetus mislead ON THE SUBJECT OF ABORTION?

reply from: yoda

I don't consider a replica to be a "fake" unless someone is trying to pass it off as the real thing. In fact, we use replicas of embryos and fetuses in the display at county fairs, and they are understood to be replicas, not "fakes". So they are not the same thing by any means.
In the identity, and in the actual plumbing. Even a woman who's had a hysterectomy is very different from a man who's had a sex change operation. The thing is, that might be important to the man who is marrying this "fake woman", and it might not be. But honesty, IMO, would require that he at least be told of the situation beforehand and let him decide for himself.
Wow..... you finally tried to respond.... amazing. But you still came up short.
That would be a deception on the subject of THAT FAKE FETUS, NOT on the "subject of abortion".
I detest veal, thank you...... I know how it was made.

reply from: yoda

Of course. That's the very definition of "fake". I thought we were past this point already?
Of course I do. But my comment on that matter is that it doesn't mislead people on the subject of abortion IF it is "accurate".
Not in my book, never.
Not in my book, no.
I don't recall, did you present it as a photo of a human fetus?
I never said it "wasn't misleading", don't you read anything I say?
I said IF it is "accurate", it doesn't mislead on the subject of abortion.
How many times must I repeat that? Couldn't you write it down somewhere?

reply from: yoda

Depends on whether it's accurate or not, wouldn't you say?
Depends on whether s/he's misrepresenting herself, wouldn't you say?

reply from: yoda

Exactly.
It is NOT "okay" (with me), but that does not mean it IS misleading, does it?
No contradiction at all.

reply from: yoda

In the case of a transgendered person, how can they be "accurate" without having all the right organs, and the right DNA?

reply from: yoda

It's not honest. Something can be dishonest without actually being misleading.
It can't be "totally accurate" unless it is a flesh and blood fetus. But that need not mean that a photo of it is misleading on the subject of abortion. To mislead someone on the subject of abortion, the photo must be INaccurate.

reply from: yoda

Nah, you caught me leaving off the phrase "on the subject of abortion", and you jumped in as if you had no idea I meant that, right? Deceptive about what? Abortion, right? NOT the identity of that "fake", but the subject of abortion, right? Do I need to put that in my sig so you won't forget it again?
I'd change that to "IS accurate". Then it would not be "misleading ON THE SUBJECT OF ABORTION!!!!!!!"
Probably not, but there is a lot more to a woman that a photo. And men don't marry photos.

reply from: yoda

What is the "subject of women" anyway? As far as I know, if a fake woman looks completely realistic, then no one would be misled about "the subject of women" by looking at that photo, no.
What is the meaning of "dishonest on the subject of abortion"? How would that relate to a photo? You're really reaching and stretching here. You know as well as anyone else that a completely dishonest person can be completely honest on one particular subject.
It doesn't matter if I (or anyone else) can tell if it's accurate, it only matters whether it is ACTUALLY accurate. And if it is, it won't mislead anyone ON THE SUBJECT OF ABORTION.

reply from: yoda

Are you sure you want to subject the whole forum to more of this? In between your announcements of victory, chest-thumping, name calling, and mischaracterizing everything I say, there isn't much but some pretty boring repetition of mundane details..... and yet you insist on more? Okie-dokie...
If something looks completely realistic in a PHOTO, then it will not mislead anyone. If it is completely accurate, then it won't mislead anyone in any other way.
What wrong impressions about ABORTION can an accurate representation of an aborted fetus give anyone? Will it make them think that a human fetus looks like a fish, or what?
It can be an accurate "representation" without having organic components.
Yeah, something like that. If you modify a male, what you have is a modified male, not a female. And if your DNA is a "both", then you are a "both", whatever the technical term is for that.

reply from: JesusLovesYou

How could a pro-abort look at, much less put together, such a beautiful representation of an unborn baby without seeing the light?
This woman has no soul!!!!

reply from: yoda

That depends on what she says to those who see the photo.
Apparently you did. So what?
Yep. But who wants to wake up on their honeymoon with a "representation" of a woman?
Nope. You're making crap up again. She certainly can be a "representation", but NOT the real thing.
I have. You just keep changing my words. Why do you do that?

reply from: JesusLovesYou

^That's the one by Vexing. Lolita's is a real baby, I've seen the picture before in different signs.

reply from: yoda

First, I want to apologize to the rest of the forum for continuing this boring, insult laced diatribe by the vexing one. I simply don't want to retreat from a challenge from someone who claims to be prolife and yet attacks prolifers, and defends proaborts at every turn.
Wow.... is that your best shot? Don't you have any coarser insults in your vocabulary? Besides, no one insulted you, I asked a question about the topic YOU brought up, and you "just can't handle the truth", can you?
And in a PHOTO.... that is still my position. Any photo that is completely realistic CANNOT MISLEAD anyone.
The rest of your gibberish needs no response. Heh!

reply from: yoda

What kind of a question is that? Is it a doctored picture? Do you supply false information with it? Why would you ask if a picture is misleading?

reply from: yoda

The answer is a very obvious "NO". I'm amazed that you even asked the question.
Why did you?

reply from: yoda

Only if she misled me intentionally by providing false information to the website.

reply from: churchmouse

Probably? LOL
Bigger animals are equal? So let me get this straight. You have a dog and a child. They both are playing outside and a car runs them over. You mourn the same for both? Their lives are equal?
You have got to be kidding me?
Soe people clearly do not play from a full deck.
Yes, I voted for Bush. Although I do not agree with him on a few issues, I felt he was the best of the two runninng. I will vote the same way this time.
Let me ask you this........who do you think the terrorists all over the world in office.......Republicans, or Democrats?
Now if you want more taxes taken out of your paycheck, you want partial birth abortions always to be an option, you want reparations, hate-crimes legislation, a dumb down military, big government.......then vote for Obama. He will gladly take your money and scew you in the process.
About the war.......oh yea the Dems are against the war alright.....Since taking control of Congress they continue to support funding the war, to the tune of over $300 billion. They could end this war in a heartbeat if they really wanted to. They dont, they just want Republicans to take the heat.
Why should we care what the Queens family does? You are hilarious. Like what does the Queen do?
You need a life.
Well that one went over your head. LOL
Ahhhhhhhhh You are so so sweet. Testing on animals is bad....especially when you think they are equal to humans. But hey.......if they could test on fetuses you would be all for that wouldnt ya?
No honey but I feel like that when I read what you write.
Thats right you didn't. And it wouldnt be on your list not with views like yours. All the characteristics of a narcissist. No conscience...........
Well I see the subject is still centered around you vexing. LOL
Yes. What if that man said that he wanted children? You going to lie as to why you can't have them? You think that lying to someone isnt bad?
Well if you think that telling lies is ok,what if someone lied that they had AIDS and played dumb? What if they knew they couldnt have children and still married the person? What if they had killed someone and served time?
Heck you can lie about anything, but is that the right thing to do to someone you love?
Can men have babies even with vaginoplasty vexing?
vexing you said that your voice would give you away. So what do you do for that..?
And do you think that is ok? Would you deceive people this way too?
If you do not tell someone that you are going to be intimate with that you have had to have surgeries to become a woman.....then you are decieving them.
Pictures are pictures and if they have not been doctored then they tell the truth. I dont see what abortion has to do with you. But then you would take any subject and twist it around to make it about you and how people don't accept you. You don't accept yourself or you would gladly tell anyone what you had to go through.
Are you saying all pictures of fetuses in the womb are fake? None are real?
It is wrong to doctor pictures and evidence. And I am sure it has been done in the past and it will be done in the future. But to say that all pictures shown by pro-lifers are false and doctored is wrong. You dont want to face facts let alone look at pictures that show the humanity of the unborn in the womb.
The fact is you were born with a penis. You were not born with any female anatomy and you cant have children. You might feel like a woman.......dress like a woman..........but physicially you were born male. Now you can take my breasts off, you can give me a male haircut, I can take hormones to grow hair.......but I still have a vagina, I still was physically born a woman.
Females can have children. Males can not. Can you get pregnant and carry a child to term?
It is never right to decieve people.
And if you are born with a penis and you alter it with surgery and do not share that IMO important piece of information with someone that you are going to be intimate with.....you are decieving them. You might feel female, but you were born with male organs and you stilll have them.
All you do is bump people when they dont cave in and believe what you say.
You cant stand it if anyone challenges you on this.
Hey I accept you as a person. You deserve to be treated in a humane way just like everyone else does. But I dont have to buy into everything you believe. No more than you have to buy into and accept what I say. Problem being, I dont care if you buy into mine and dont bash you for it. You however do it to people who dont buy into what you say.
Why do you care what people think? It is obvious that your primary goal here is not the unborn child. Its not even talking about the unborn child. You dont care about the unborn child, because you make you the topic everywhere you go on here. Yoda asks simple questions.......that you run from.
Why?
Of course pictures that are doctored are fake. Big whoopin deal. What does that have to do with your anatomy? You are not a picture. One does not have a relationship with a picture. You are more than that arent you?
For crying out loud........we are hear because the majority of us are passionate about the unborn chilld and the inhumanity of abortion.
I'm gone on vacation for 9 days......come back and your anatomy is still a top subject.
vexing said,
What if he wanted children? What would you say then? Would you tell your family doctor that you didnt want your husband to know the real truth? Would you lie about the hormone pills you have to take daily to keep up the appearance? Just how many lies would you have to tell to cover up the truth?
So what if he wanted children?
If you love yourself, if you are proud of what you have gone through.......then why do you feel you have to lie?
Why do you want to hide it? Especially to someone that loves you and might accept you for who you are?
I cant believe yoda has been this patient.

reply from: yoda

Different situation, different rules. Looking at a photo and marrying someone are worlds apart. Marriage requires total honesty about one's self and one's past.

reply from: churchmouse

What if he asked why?
Why doenst he need to know? You are lying and trying to cover up the truth. You spin it any way you want.......but that is what you are doing IMO.
Of course you want to adopt, there is nothing wrong with adoption. But its your only choice if you want children and you should be upfront with you mate about this.
If you take a covenant with someone seriously then you DO NOT LIE.
I think changing sex is a little more important news to share with someone than a fart.
To lie in order to decieve someone into a relationship is WRONG.
Should someone that was getting married reveal that they had AIDS? HERPES?
Any disease for that matter?
What if medicine can mask the symptons? Isnt that ok?
Should a person reveal their criminal past even if they paid their dues?
"Hey I killed someone but I paid the time for my crime, it doesnt matter."
What if someone had children by someone else and didnt tell you? That ok? All of a sudden one day at your door they appear.

reply from: churchmouse

The truth? You spin the truth to suit you and decieve him. Its all about you remember. You were physically born male. And to not tell someone about this is decieving them.
Would you tell him that accidently you were born with a penis?
That you were not born with female genitals, female anatomy that, that is why you are sterile?
Of course not.......its about you, not your partner.
Not if you love them with all your heart.
I never said that. Answer the question.
I am talking about possible lies that people might tell. Of course you play the victim here so YOU CAN AVOID ANSWERING THE QUESTION.
Here it is again.
I want to see just how many lies is ok to tell someone you love. LOL
And you run again from answering. LOL You dont want to answer vexing because I am sure you would agree that all these things I mention should be shared with a partner. Its not ok to lie unless its to cover up that you were born male.
I am talking about decieving.....lying about ANYTHING......to a partner, a spouse.
Now answer the questions.

reply from: churchmouse

Tt might be mutual on your partners side.......but if you do not tell the truth about yourself you would be lying.
How can it be mutual when you are not honest and decieve?
LOL You are the master at spinning I will say that.
You think it would be mysterious and cool for you to withhold information that you had surgery to remove your penis........to your partner?
ITS CALLED DECEIT.
Sorry its a biggy to me. I guess I expect more from a lifelong parnter than you do.
I dont want mystery, I want love and honesty.

reply from: churchmouse

Your lying about who you really are because you are afraid if you shared that kind of information with a partner it might end the relationship.
You spin it anyway you want.....IMO you are intentionally decieving someone.

reply from: galen

and you my dear have never ever ever kept ANYTHING from someone you cred about... not even you parents?
you scold vexing because you can not face the things YOu have done wrong yourself...simple psychology my dear..

reply from: yoda

I'm not sure if you've actually read this whole thread, so I'll ask you the pertinent question: Do you think a transgendered person would have a moral obligation to inform someone of their TG status before marrying them?

reply from: galen

i think that it would be up to the couple involved to tell each other whatever secrets they feel ready to tell.
Personally if i were in that situation with my husband i would tell him.
I would not presume to tell anyone else what to do in that situation however. and i would NOT go preaching morality lessons to someone in that situation without knowing the whole story first.
i think its telling that somepeople think thay can do so without first knowing someone and walking in thier shoes a bit. especially when that someone is a person who uses this forum as thier own personal street-corner ministry.

reply from: churchmouse

You meant me right? LOL
Well Mary you obviously dont like witnessing, but thats you.
And I wont apologize for doing it. Its more important to me than anything else.
Proverbs 12:22, "Lying lips are abomination to the LORD: but they that deal truly are his delight."
Jeremiah 7:4, "Trust ye not in lying words,"
1 John 2:21, "I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth."
"and you my dear have never ever ever kept ANYTHING from someone you cred about... not even you parents?"
We are talking about decieving a spouse or partner before getting into a committed relationship. I dont sleep and have sex with my parents. I married my husband......
You said you would have told your husband.........WHY THEN WOULD YOU?
You are luke warm on everything galen
Before marriage or after.......before the first sex act or after? One year after or ten years..........?

reply from: nancyu

Churchmouse, there is a difference between witnessing and preaching. We all do it sometimes, but holy moly, you take the cake sometimes.

reply from: faithman

I'm not sure if you've actually read this whole thread, so I'll ask you the pertinent question: Do you think a transgendered person would have a moral obligation to inform someone of their TG status before marrying them?
Well if TG were tatooed on there forhead it would solve everything. But most TGers make cutting their tally whacker off the major issue of everything they do, So i would guess they would have a hard time keeping such odsession a secret anyway. Put to answere the question, yes, they have an obligation to make their self mutilation known to anyone they are thinking of getting involved with.

reply from: galen

Before marriage or after.......before the first sex act or after? One year after or ten years..........?
_____________________________________________________
so in your world.. if you aren't sleeping with them THEN its OK to lie to them??
and you say i'm weird....
no i'm not lukewarm on every subject...i absolutely HATE abortion...but when you stick your nose into everyone elses business you end up having no time for your own.

reply from: churchmouse

It is a sin to lie. But you dont have enough guts to tell vexing that cause gosh forbid you cant offend anyone can you? So you sit the fence and play like you are so sweet. So your against abortion we discuss more than just abortion here.
Me stick my nose into everyones business? How do I do that? I comment on comments people make? You don't?
Go write another one of your sick poems mary.........show some more hate, you do it well at least to me you do. And heck your friends that dont ever hold you accountable for the things you say can once again can....... console you..... make you feel all warm and fuzzy.

reply from: Jameberlin

CM, i think it's lying, and i would be pissed. I really would, be completely pissed. I haven't said this before, because i was trying to be patient and give Vexing the benefit of the doubt, because it's truly a difficult way to live, the way God made "her" (Vexing, i use quotations, because i don't want to call you it, or he, or she, when you are, chromosomally both).
I'm sorry Vexing told you to hurt yourself with a rusty pipe, i wish i would have seen it, i would have said something.
I have no idea who Galen is, or what she stands for or anything. I don't think it's right, though, to say just because people DO lie, that makes it OKAY to lie.
I have to say, when i'm dealing with my husband, and he fails to tell me something because "i didn't ask" i hit the roof, it never fails, i think he sometimes does it on purpose... haha. Of course, when i asked him if what Vexing was talking about (omitting information about past organ change to a partner) was lying, he OF COURSE, said "no", but i think he would feel differently if it were me omitting the information... *sigh*

reply from: galen

poor poor church mouse
never got to rabble rouse,
Only saw fit to stare,
with iron teeth her words were there.
gushing torment undermines,
relationships,
and her lines.
won't even come up for air,
when the face of her god is near.
Pity the woman who can not see,
past her own shame,
to espie beauty.

reply from: churchmouse

And if your spouse asked why you were infertile what would you say?
And if your spouse asked why you have scares down below from your reconstructive surgery, you would say WHAT?
You can decieve someone and not say a word.
You can be an adulterer and if your spouse never asks.......the truth is still the truth.
And for you Galen........I simply feel sorry for you.
I am still praying for you to get saved.

reply from: galen

why do you care about me or vexing and what she says to her SO?

reply from: churchmouse

vexing said,
So because you are not getting married......you can lie?
No scares........so there are no scares from removing an organ? Wow. How do you know.....you havent had the surgery have you?
nancy said, "Churchmouse, there is a difference between witnessing and preaching. We all do it sometimes, but holy moly, you take the cake sometimes.'
Well you might be right nancy.......but God is first in my life and I take the Great Commission seriously.......it comes first for me even before abortion work.
But for me as a Christian, I cant separate abortion and Gods Word.

Boy you take Goth to a new level Mary. What beautiful words.......do they honor Christ? Or do you write them because you want to be elevated?
Why not find something to post from you bible if you can find it.


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