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by: xj2x

I am doing an assignment for school in which i am investigating whether pro choice or pro life is more beneficial for societies and cultures across time.
1. How does an abortion psychologically affect a woman?
2. How will disallowing sexual education lessen the need for abortions?
3. What do you believe should happen in the case of forced sex resulting in pregnancy?
4. "Abortion doesn't automatically harm fertility" What is your opinion on this statement?
I am also open to different opinions on the topic. Don't hold back!

reply from: galen

here are some links..
my personal opinion and my medical experience tell me that
1) abortion can cause PTSDT in any woman, and this is not adressed in counseling patients about to undergo abortion. Women are often relieved at first to be rid of thier problem, and then find themselves griefstricken later on.
2)sex ed in appropriate form will lessen the need for abortion, but must be done in a manner that teenagers will listen to. Sex ed should also stress abstinance as no sex = not STD's and no pregnancy.
3)Rape is never a reason to abort.. i have a child by rape. He is not responsible for the rape. If a woman can not bear to keep the child it can be adopted out. Abortion post rape also inflicts another assault physically and mentally on an already traumatised woman.
4)Abortion in some instances may not be harmful to fertility. However the # of infertile women who have also had an abortion earlier in life has increased markedly sense abortion was legalised. In my praqctice thier are many women who have had 1 or more AB's and then found out later they are infertile due to scarring, or who can achieve pregnancy but can not carry one due to dmage of thier cervix, caused by the procedure t open the cervix during thier abortion.
http://www.afterabortion.org/rape.html
http://hills.ccsf.edu/~jinouy01/abort/abort_victims.html
http://www.abortionfacts.com/life_or_choice/pro_choice.asp
http://www.pregnantpause.org/aborted/curerape.htm
http://www.sexetc.org/story/adoption/2098
http://teenadvice.about.com/library/weekly/aa122100a.htm
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2006/09/060927201526.htm
http://www.physiciansforlife.org/content/view/820/27/
http://www.pregnantteenhelp.org/articles59.html
http://www.duofertility.com/en/my-fertility/can-duofertility-help-me/past-abortions.html
http://www.nhsdirect.nhs.uk/articles/article.aspx?articleId=1645#
http://www.christianet.com/abortionfacts/surgicalabortioncomplications.htm
http://www.nrlc.org/abortion/ASMF/index.html
http://www.physiciansforlife.org/content/view/1213/2/

reply from: LiberalChiRo

Initially, the majority of women are relieved. As time goes on it does seem that most end up changing their minds and regretting the decision. The minority that initially regret the decision are often traumatized and need a lot of therapy to help them through it. Some women even decide not to have any other children, feeling that they lost their right by killing their first.
It won't, it will in fact lead to MORE abortions. Sexual education is extremely important in the fight against abortion. Getting rid of it is the stupidest thing we could do.
It's called rape, and what should happen is up to the woman and her doctor/counselor.
It's true. Many women overseas use abortion as a sole form of birth control and may have upwards of 10 of them in a lifetime before giving birth to perfectly healthy children. Clearly their fertility is not affected.

reply from: nancyu

An unborn child is a person. It is illegal to murder persons. Abortion is murder of an innocent person. Those who commit this crime should be arrested and tried for murder.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

You should do some research on impartial websites that are NOT related to either pro-life or pro-choice groups. There were sites recommended to you in another post, but they are pro-life oriented and will not be impartial.

reply from: faithman

You should do some research on impartial websites that are NOT related to either pro-life or pro-choice groups. There were sites recommended to you in another post, but they are pro-life oriented and will not be impartial.
What is SSSSSOOOOO impartial about killing womb children? It is a hate crime that should be punished.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

Oops, I read question #4 wrong - missed the "doesn't" part!
No, abortion does not harm fertility in most women any more than childbirth harms fertility.

reply from: galen

i gave site from both sides of the pond.. there are no impatial sites just ones for both sides..pro and against abortion.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

You are correct, there are several impartial sites in your list - but others are blatantly pro-life.
I do feel sorry for the young couple in one of the articles - they plan on having their baby, finishing high school by means of homeschooling and then taking turns attending college on scholarships. Good luck with that plan, kids - you might be waiting a long while for those scholarships to come through.

reply from: galen

not necessarily, and pell grants are useful too.. good grades and a willingness to tell a college what they are working for and twards makes a diffrence also.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

I got through college fine on scholarships and grants, but I did have some help from my parents. I wouldn't have needed it at all if I'd been claimed independent on taxes.

reply from: galen

good point especially for scholarships...you can get emancipated and qualify for all sorts of stuff.
i too got through on my own speed so i know what its like.
If there is a will there is a way.

reply from: nancyu

You are correct, there are several impartial sites in your list - but others are blatantly pro-life.
I do feel sorry for the young couple in one of the articles - they plan on having their baby, finishing high school by means of homeschooling and then taking turns attending college on scholarships. Good luck with that plan, kids - you might be waiting a long while for those scholarships to come through.
Did y'all know that it is a crime to be "blatantly pro-life"?

reply from: LiberalChiRo

All she meant was that the sites are not unbiased. She wasn't saying they are criminal.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

Then why did you just say "Did you know that it is a crime to be "blatantly pro-life", aka insinuating that SHE felt it is criminal.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

I simply prefer unbiased websites for ANY type of information. Not criminal, just careful.

reply from: faithman

You are simply lying. By "unbiased" you mena blatantly pro-abort liberal eletist. Aint it funny how secular humanist amorralist, want to claim moral high ground when they have none?

reply from: yoda

Yep, and I'm guilty as heck. I'm serving a "life sentence" now!

reply from: yoda

On the subject of abortion, there are very few unbiased people, much less unbiased websites. Few people will bother much with this subject unless they are strongly motivated (a.k.a "biased") one way or the other. Typically, that leaves it up to the reader to decide whom to believe, or to try to do the research him/herself. Personally, I have confidence that 99.9% of prolife sources will be honest, because I've met so many new prolife people during my "activist" period who are honest. Frankly, that's one of the greatest rewards of being a prolife activist.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

It's hard to find unbiased sites which is why I now try to find one pro-life and one pro-choice site for the information I'm seeking. You get some very contradictory information when you do that; it's almost comical!

reply from: faithman

It would be real funny if children were not dying by the thousands everyday.

reply from: galen

here's the thing.. everyone is biased for or against something.. that's the way humans work.. no one is completely nutral no matter how much we wish to be. The best i can ever do is verify the evedence prsented and make a call on that.. even if its from a pro abortion/choice site.

reply from: yoda

Especially on abortion.... it's the most divisive topic in our society right now, IMO.

reply from: galen

yep it is definately one of the high ones.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

Yes, I do prefer to get medical information from doctors with doctorate degrees from real medical schools and actual universities rather than from people with mail-order or Internet degrees whose knowledge of medicine comes from dubious sources. Same way with geography, math, science, theology and other subjects - REAL experts.

reply from: yoda

If the author of this study isn't a "real doctor", then why are his articles being published by several medical journals?
Oh, btw, the degrees after the name denote time spent in universities, not an absence of bias.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

Which study?
And yes, I'm sure education provides some kind of bias.

reply from: LiberalChiRo

Gotta say I agree there.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

Really, guys, if you had a theological question, would ask the altar server or the priest? The Youth for Christ members or the pastor?
And, dare I ask, do you go to the Douay-Rheims, King James, New International Version, New King James, Revised Standard Version, Darby, Young's Literal Translation, Webster's Bible Translation, New Living Translation, Third Millenium, Good News, World English, American Standard Version, Weymouth or another version of your choice for your answers from "The Holy Bible"?
Maybe I shouldn't have asked that question . . .

reply from: yoda

It was in the OP of the thread "a startling article", about an article by David Reardon, Ph.D., director of the Elliot Institute based in Springfield, IL.
That depends upon the bias of the educators, I suppose. Why, who said it did?

reply from: galen

________________________________________________________-
i would find everything under the sun that Catholicism says about the issue...everything i could lay my hands on.. then i would discuss it with my priest or bishop.. and yes possibly a server.. if the question was within thier relm of expertise.. ie where to buy Father a new set of vestments for Christmas, or why do you do such and such on a certain day of the year. Depends on what the exac t question would be.
i never dismiss out of hand info because i don't like someones level of education.. i do dismiss someones thoughts on a subject id they are obviously comming out thier arse and being used just to inflame or defame.. ie spinny.....

reply from: RiverMoonLady

Maybe I'm making a gross assumption here, Galen, but I would guess that on THEOLOGICAL QUESTIONS your priest (bishop, cardinal, etc.) would have better answers than the altar server.
As for non-theological subjects, other people certainly might know better.

reply from: RiverMoonLady

It was in the OP of the thread "a startling article", about an article by David Reardon, Ph.D., director of the Elliot Institute based in Springfield, IL.
Oh, I understand now. Sorry, Mr. Reardon is basically making money (and a name for himself) from the pro-life movement and if you have supported him, I am very sorry for you. He is like one of those TV evangelists who is actually a hypocrite and fraud.
That depends upon the bias of the educators, I suppose. Why, who said it did?
Nobody - just an observation. Although I'm not sure how a Catholic university would teach mathematics with a bias compared to Princeton or UCLA.

reply from: yoda

That's some pretty heavy slander for someone who has no evidence of what they are saying.
ALL prolife activists have to make money from the prolife movement, or at least from prolife sympathizers. What's wrong with that? Isn't a full time preacher allowed to make money off religion?
What proof do you have of his "hypocrisy" or "fraudulent" acts? Or is being prolife enough to convict him?

reply from: galen

possibly yes but possibly no.. that is the point.. oneof our servers is in his 40's one of our priests is in his late 20's...sometimes the younger priest deferrs to the wisdom and knowledge of the older gentleman..you never dismiss anyone out of hand.. not only is it poor form.. its also means you may miss out on something important.
For instance.. here i read everything before i comment on it...no matter who posts it.. this is why i do not put anyone on ignore.. every once in a while someone surprises me with a really insightful comment or somesuch that is completely unexpected from that person.
but that is just me.. as i said bias is always there because we are human...no one can escape it.
even a nutral country in a war situation is not as nuetral as everyone might assume.

reply from: galen

It was in the OP of the thread "a startling article", about an article by David Reardon, Ph.D., director of the Elliot Institute based in Springfield, IL.
Oh, I understand now. Sorry, Mr. Reardon is basically making money (and a name for himself) from the pro-life movement and if you have supported him, I am very sorry for you. He is like one of those TV evangelists who is actually a hypocrite and fraud.
That depends upon the bias of the educators, I suppose. Why, who said it did?
Nobody - just an observation. Although I'm not sure how a Catholic university would teach mathematics with a bias compared to Princeton or UCLA.
______________________________________________________
bad example .. math is math .. there is no way to be biased religiously in math...
or physics.. or chemistry...
biology ,art ,literature, history etc are better examples of where bias reigns.

reply from: galen

That's some pretty heavy slander for someone who has no evidence of what they are saying.
ALL prolife activists have to make money from the prolife movement, or at least from prolife sympathizers. What's wrong with that? Isn't a full time preacher allowed to make money off religion?
What proof do you have of his "hypocrisy" or "fraudulent" acts? Or is being prolife enough to convict him?
______________________________________________
i'm also interested to know this ^^^^^^

reply from: sander

That's some pretty heavy slander for someone who has no evidence of what they are saying.
ALL prolife activists have to make money from the prolife movement, or at least from prolife sympathizers. What's wrong with that? Isn't a full time preacher allowed to make money off religion?
What proof do you have of his "hypocrisy" or "fraudulent" acts? Or is being prolife enough to convict him?
Apparently ONLY proaborts are allowed bias with impunity. Anything from a pro-lifer is dismissed...how biased is that?
And where did the orginal post go, by Moonlady accusing this man of "fraud? I'm only seeing the replies, maybe I missed it?

reply from: galen

i never saw one either sander...

reply from: sander

How odd.
The moderator must have tought it crossed a huge line for it to have been deleted, since we can't do that ourselves?

reply from: galen

you goof!
of course we can... didn't you know Yoda is the 'moderator' of the forum... he has magical powers!

reply from: maxer

I need help too. I have been debating Pro Choice folks on a debate website and I'm now at my wits end. Any help? One guy said a fetus is a parasite in a womens body. HOW DO I RESPOND TO THAT!?!?! Any help? There is a bunch of left wing people on that site and they all hit me a one time. I need info and website links I can post to shut them up, or at least slow them down so I can breath. They are mostly young and have no idea what a child is. It is a shame they can post stuff liek that a warp other young minds on that site. I'm trying, any help????

reply from: 4given

For you? Perhaps. What is your stance on abortion?

reply from: Teresa18

I've been where you are, Maxer. I found this forum by debating liberals. They will jump on you on this or any other topic like a pack of pro-death rats. If you provide a link to the forum, I'll try to help you out with arguments.

reply from: maxer

Pro Life. Abortion is pure death, there is no excuse or reason for it. I may be a little more extreme then others, for me there is NO reason for abortion. Abortion is just ONE issue that is abused on this site.
http://debate.com/

reply from: Teresa18

Do you have a link to a specific thread? I went to the forum, but I'm not sure where you are and what threads you are having a debate on.

reply from: 4given

If you are willing to link me to the "debate" in question.. I did search for "abortion". Link?

reply from: 4given

I miss Sander.. Praying all is well with her and her brood.

reply from: Teresa18

I miss her too. Yoda said she posts at the Sarah Palin Forums. I went over there and signed up. I saw posts from her and Yoda. I haven't posted there yet.

reply from: yoda

You mean like on a semantic (definition) question a dictionary would have better answers than an anonymous, biased poster on an online forum?
Is that kinda what you had in mind?

reply from: yoda

That was a quote from another thread.

reply from: yoda

Nah, I'm the "conscience" of the forum...... and I forgot where I put my magic ring.

reply from: yoda

She and I both post there. It's a nice place, and a lot fewer trolls and proaborts than here.

reply from: carolemarie

If you are interested in how abortion affects women, here are some sites from women who regret their abortions.
www.operationoutcry.org
andn silentnomoreawareness.org
This site features women who are not sorry.
Iamnot sorry.org.

reply from: 4given

Do you suppose that any of the women on this site, don't think of their child- burned, mutilated or discarded due to their selfish or otherwise ill-regard? I have to wonder why you would even present (promote) such a site. Pro-l..i..f..e.. Curious.

reply from: nancyu

Good!~ Here is a link to help with that old "parasite" argument:
http://www.l4l.org/library/notparas.html

reply from: BossMomma

1)Abortion affects women in many different ways, some feel regret, some don't.
2)Disallowing sex ed. will result in further ignorance and probably more unplanned pregnancies and abortions.
3)I believe that a rape victim should be allowed to use the Morning After Pill which can be obtained easily at any OB/GYN's office so long as the doctor's religious preference doesn't interfere.
4)Abortion has not been shown to interfere with fertility at all.

reply from: Babykillersnomore

I AM NOT A TROLL. ICH HASSE BABIES IS ALL.

reply from: carolemarie

Do you suppose that any of the women on this site, don't think of their child- burned, mutilated or discarded due to their selfish or otherwise ill-regard? I have to wonder why you would even present (promote) such a site. Pro-l..i..f..e.. Curious.
because abortion affects different women differently. He was doing a paper, and usually in school you need to present both viewpoints on a topic.

reply from: nancyu

Do you suppose that any of the women on this site, don't think of their child- burned, mutilated or discarded due to their selfish or otherwise ill-regard? I have to wonder why you would even present (promote) such a site. Pro-l..i..f..e.. Curious.
because abortion affects different women differently. He was doing a paper, and usually in school you need to present both viewpoints on a topic.
As do you?

reply from: nancyu

Do you suppose that any of the women on this site, don't think of their child- burned, mutilated or discarded due to their selfish or otherwise ill-regard? I have to wonder why you would even present (promote) such a site. Pro-l..i..f..e.. Curious.
because abortion affects different women differently. He was doing a paper, and usually in school you need to present both viewpoints on a topic.
It's easy for anyone who can read, to see that you are not especially sorry for having killed three of your own unborn children. I see nothing wrong with presenting both sides of any debate. But you have to admit that someone claiming to be pro life, directing another to a pro abortion website, is odd to say the least.
I wish, that if not to anyone else, you would learn to be truthful with yourself. You are no more pro life than any abortion clinic worker. I become more doubtful by the day, that you are not one yourself.

reply from: carolemarie

Sticks and stones will break my bones but YOUR words will never hurt me.
I am curious as to why you want to.....feel free to explain it to me.

reply from: efilorp

jesus loves her even though she is mean and cruel
amen

reply from: faithman

And you are a phony passive aggressive puke who tries to manipulate others with your persuado spirituality. You form of "compassion" is the real cruelty here. While you are playing nice with the killers, they continue to slaughter children in the womb. Justice first, then compassion and mercy. That is what Christ taught. Not this sloppy agopy you use to slander others with, no matter what name you use here.

reply from: faithman

Do you suppose that any of the women on this site, don't think of their child- burned, mutilated or discarded due to their selfish or otherwise ill-regard? I have to wonder why you would even present (promote) such a site. Pro-l..i..f..e.. Curious.
because abortion affects different women differently. He was doing a paper, and usually in school you need to present both viewpoints on a topic.
It's easy for anyone who can read, to see that you are not especially sorry for having killed three of your own unborn children. I see nothing wrong with presenting both sides of any debate. But you have to admit that someone claiming to be pro life, directing another to a pro abortion website, is odd to say the least.
I wish, that if not to anyone else, you would learn to be truthful with yourself. You are no more pro life than any abortion clinic worker. I become more doubtful by the day, that you are not one yourself.
Looks like CM enjoys talking to herself. Notice how her "buddy" always posts after her? Same passive aggressive crap as well. They don't even have enough respect for the name of Jesus to capitalize the first letter of His name. But the killer sure loves to look down it's long nose of condesention at others. These slanderous little pukes are as phony as they come folks. Take note of their tactics, and don't be fooled by them. CM is more dangerous to the womb child than a hundred Planned Parenthood clinic workers. They constantly undermine the personhood of the womb child, and exalt their killers. But of course if you are one, you stick with those of simular feather.

reply from: monkeeboi

Are Nancy and FM husband and wife? The same poster even? Certainly peas in a pod. Does it personally offend you when others fail to belittle those you disagree with? How childish. What do you hope to accomplish by acting like complete asswipes? Does it make you feel good? Are you sexually frustrated, and unable to gain satisfaction in any other way? Help me understand this.
I've seen some peculiar behavior from people claiming to be prolife in my day, but posters on this forum really take the cake. I think it's entirely possible that FM, at least, is a fake, a prochoicer who is here to make prolifers look like a bunch of @ss holes. Thanks to him for this screen name, though. I like it, and it goes with the avatar. Keep up the good work!

reply from: B0zo

LOL
They seem to at least be "soul mates."
It would surely be a dream come true for NARAL and the likes if those two could be the poster boy and the poster girl of the prolife cause.

reply from: B0zo

Was she "dangerous" to the hundreds of "womb children" she saved as a sidewalk counselor?
You don't make much sense.

reply from: faithman

You have never proven that claim to be true, but we have most assuredly proven CM to be a liar on this forum.

reply from: B0zo

Sure, I'll prove it as best I can when you prove she's a "killer of three" and a "streetwalker."
Tell me why you're so convinced about that.
And your unneccary detective work over a post in a forum did reveal a connection to prolife activities, so that made her more credible that she's a prolife activist and not just saying she is.
Lasty, suppose it is true that she has helped save hundreds of babies because of sidewalk counseling?

reply from: faithman

Here's the deal. You choose to ignore the facts, and embrace fantacy. My "detective work" was very much nessisary. Her lies put CPC's in danger of criminal investigation. It is a crime to not report sexual activity of minors to the proper authorities. I am bond by law to report reasonable suspicion of sexual activity of minors. My "detecive work" made such a report unnessisary, and put CPC's on alert that they could be put under investigation for non-reporting violations. Every one of them I contacted were thankful for the heads up, and they were the ones who pursued CM and made her fess up to her lies. I took her story seriously until it was proven to be false. Secondly, She is the one who came to this forum, bragging about being a street walker, and a murderer of three womb children. I will take that claim to be true until it is proven to be a lie. You are the one who claims she has "saved hundred's" of womb children from abortion. A claim that is backed up by what? Besides I have never voiced any objection to any of those claims except a call for proof, which you have failed to produce. My problem is with her alone, not all post abortive like you and others have slanderously claimed. But I will enumerate all the problems once again even though I have over and over again posted them. The issue has always been about personhood. If personhood is established, then the womb child is protected by the 14th amendment. Your lying friend has point blank stated that she would fight personhood if it meant that their murders would meet the justice they deserve. She has also point blank stated that the womb child are not at the same "level" as a born child. Which is straight out of the PP play book. If you want to be a stupid clown and ignore these facts, then the blood of the womb children she has helped kill is on you. She has shown no remorse for killing her own children, on the contrary, she has made excuse after excuse for the murder she comited. Both of you are as phony as can be. So it is understandable why you lick her whore boots at almost every turn.

reply from: Spinwubby

Originally posted by: faithman
Here's the deal. You choose to ignore the facts, and embrace fantacy. My "detective work" was very much nessisary.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Detective work?
You used the personal information she gave you in order to receive your goofy "I Am A Person" cards. You used that information to stalk and harass her.
That's OK, we have now warned every newbie who arrives here that "IAAP" is a ficticious organization trying to sucker-in donors, and that any correspondence with you leads to potentially dangerous contact with an Army of God member.
I know that I've done all that I can to steer unsuspecting pro-lifers away from a terrorist-sympathizing stalker and your moronic fetus photo.

reply from: nancyu

Too bad your slander fails for anyone with a functioning brain and conscience. Anyone who knows who faithman really is, can see that he is a gentleman who wouldn't harm a fly. Then again, flies don't set out to kill children.
The greatest threat to a woman's "right to choose" to kill her own children is personhood for unborn children. So it is understandable why they all feel that slander is necessary. Lord knows their "logic" isn't working.

reply from: nancyu

http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=the_politics_of_stillbirth
From "The Politics of Stillbirth" Allison Stevens | July 16, 2007
You see, the only problem for them is that unborn children ARE persons. For a pro abort that little truth is such a nuisance.

reply from: SpitMcGee

Too bad your slander fails for anyone with a functioning brain and conscience. Anyone who knows who faithman really is, can see that he is a gentleman who wouldn't harm a fly. Then again, flies don't set out to kill children.
The greatest threat to a woman's "right to choose" to kill her own children is personhood for unborn children. So it is understandable why they all feel that slander is necessary. Lord knows their "logic" isn't working.
Yeah, Spinwubby, leave Faithman alone! He's a polite gentleman trying to protect fetuses from the monsters that are one-third of U.S. women out to maim the sh!t out of them.
Look at this gentleman's posts. Have you ever seen one slanderous thing, one use of profane language or cruelty? Hell no! Not him. He treats all other human beings (who agree with him politically) with respect, as a pro-lifer should.
He's on a mission to stop dehumanization of the fetus by calling out all the *****s and whores, soulless killers, worthless sluts, and other faceless walking wombs who dare to disagree with him.
Personhood is all-encompassing. It extends anywhere--even up your vagina.

reply from: faithman

You are a liar. That never happened. I never received her information for anything. She got her cards from another sources. I have stalked no one. I don't know where the killer lives, nor would I recognize the scanc if I passed her in public. So shut your slanderous mouth unless you can prove what you post.

reply from: faithman

Too bad your slander fails for anyone with a functioning brain and conscience. Anyone who knows who faithman really is, can see that he is a gentleman who wouldn't harm a fly. Then again, flies don't set out to kill children.
The greatest threat to a woman's "right to choose" to kill her own children is personhood for unborn children. So it is understandable why they all feel that slander is necessary. Lord knows their "logic" isn't working.
Yeah, Spinwubby, leave Faithman alone! He's a polite gentleman trying to protect fetuses from the monsters that are one-third of U.S. women out to maim the sh!t out of them.
Look at this gentleman's posts. Have you ever seen one slanderous thing, one use of profane language or cruelty? Hell no! Not him. He treats all other human beings (who agree with him politically) with respect, as a pro-lifer should.
He's on a mission to stop dehumanization of the fetus by calling out all the *****s and whores, soulless killers, worthless sluts, and other faceless walking wombs who dare to disagree with him.
Personhood is all-encompassing. It extends anywhere--even up your vagina.
You finally posted something that is correct.

reply from: Banned Member

Failman, u tryin 2 hard. A good troll is never obvious.

reply from: nancyu

http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=the_politics_of_stillbirth
From "The Politics of Stillbirth" Allison Stevens | July 16, 2007
You see, the only problem for them is that unborn children ARE persons. For a pro abort that little truth is such a nuisance.

reply from: B0zo

Nobody "bragged" about being a streetwalker or having three abortions. That's an intentionally false mischaracterization.
She claims to be a Christian and to have been forgiven and delivered from those ways of her distant past, so it would not be "bragging" since she admits they were sins. Yet you persist in calling her a "streetwalker" as if she were one right now, and persist in calling her a "killer" as if she were one right now, and never a word of gratitude or encouragement regarding her sidewalk counseling.
You believe what you want to believe, and reject what you don't want to believe. You accept that she is telling the truth about her abortions and other sins, yet reject that she is a prolife activist preventing abortions by sidewalk counseling.
There's no use reasoning with you anymore or with your nasty sidekick. If this board were run decently, your verbal abuse and bullying would not be allowed, but for some reason the owner of this board chooses to give you free reign, and that's his business as the board owner, but morally wrong on several levels--as a Christian, as a gentleman, and as someone who is in charge of a prolife organization dependent upon dontations. He allows you to give prolifers a black eye, and I'll never understand why he would allow this board to be associated with his organization, unless he figures those who donate don't bother to read this stuff.
I'm not going to bother with you anymore. I can reason with a brick a lot easier than I can reason with you. You're either a blockhead or a nasty old coot who uses the unborn and this cause as a way to compensate for low self-esteem. You can excuse any verbal abuse because "it's for the babies" (who you are shamefully using).
My defense of carolemarie is not personal. It's just the right thing to do to stand up against such bullying and cruelty--for her or anyone else. That doesn't mean I agree with her about everything, but a disagreement does not give me the right or privilege to dredge up the sins of her past. Any dufus would know that, let alone a Christian.
In your world, if someone was in prison, even if he's paid his dues and admits his previous errors, he's still "a convict." Anyone who disagrees with you deserves to be called a punk or a scanc. You have a huge ego, dude.
You have the board owner on your side, so you can continue to dominate and continue to be abusive, and continue to be an internet prolife/christian posterboy, and continue to drive away thoughtful and respectful prolifers or those still discerning.
You're not credible as a prolife advocate. You're a stumbling block.

reply from: faithman

Here is where you are wrong clown. The scanc has cavalierly dismissed the murder of three children as a youthful mistake, and claimed to feel no remorse about doing so. There is no mischaractorization on my part at all. Anyone with a lick of sense knows what this killer has posted here. She uses the same words and arguments as a borthead on a very regular basis. And you have been told along with your killer friend, if you don't like the way the forum is run leave and never come back. I make no apologies for standing for the womb child, and confronting their deadly enemies.

reply from: B0zo

Calling someone who did some time, but reformed, a "convict," is NOT "for the unborn."
Attempting to publicly humiliate someone and degrade them because of alleged clutter in a photograph is NOT "for the babies."
Calling people "scancs," "whores," "punks," and "pukes," etc. etc., is NOT "for the babies."
It's all for faithman, because faithman has a cruel streak and needs an excuse to indulge it, so he hides behind the babies.
And CM most certainly has posted enough times her regret about her abortions, but you refuse to acknowledge it.
And I'm free (so far) to condemn your abusiveness and the board owner's encouragement and toleration of it, and if you don't like that, then you could be the one to leave.

reply from: Spinwubby

Originally posted by: B0zo
Calling someone who did some time, but reformed, a "convict," is NOT "for the unborn."
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
IRONY ALERT!
Faithman has done time behind bars and is a self-admitted alcoholic.

reply from: B0zo

And I would never say a peep about it, and neither would CM or Churchmouse, or any other Christian or person of faith who has some common sense and humility. I would not rub his nose in his past sins, in spite of his own challenges regarding graciousness.

reply from: faithman

Little phony punks like you don't bother me at all. I think it some what strange that you constantly defend the killers , and ignore the womb children. 3 dollar bills have nothing on you for being phony.

reply from: B0zo

I see you dodged the points that were made.
You use this cause selfishly. You use it as an excuse to demean, belittle, abuse, and otherwise feel good about yourself, but at the expense of others.
That doen't make me a "phony" to point that our or to call you on your methods, and that is a cheap way to dodge the issue. If you and the likes of you are the only "real" ones, then God help us.

reply from: faithman

I have never dodged anything. You have that tactic sown up.


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