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Donna Holman PO Box 2540 Iowa City, IA 52244

by: faithman

Donna Holman ; PO Box 2540 ; Iowa City, IA 52244 Please contiue to send Donna a note. The pro-aborts must read her mail as part of their job. Any kind of pro-life literature would be really a good read for them.

reply from: xnavy

who is donna holman???

reply from: joe

Accomplished more for the ones that matter than you ever will. Can your feeble mind understand that?

reply from: yoda

She's an unfortunate elderly prolife woman who ran afoul of a proabort female judge out in Nebraska. She was initially arrested for picketing in front of the home of an abortionist, and then further railroaded by the court, even though the person filing the complaint failed to show up in court, and the judge refused to look at a video tape of the arrest.
Here's the basic story: "Donna Holman, a 72 year-old grandmother of sixteen, was falsely arrested by Iowa City police, was tried in a kangaroo court, was ordered to submit to a psychiatric evaluation and ordered to take any psychotropic drugs the psychiatrist recommends. She refused and now sits in the Johnson County Jail in Iowa City, Iowa, for a 30 day sentence! Being a modest woman, she refused to stand naked in front of her captors who demanded she do so when she entered the jail. In retaliation, the jailers put her in a cell and took away her blanket so that she spent the first night awake and shivering."
This is the website of the organization she works with:
http://www.missionariestopreborn.com/]http://www.missionariestopreborn.com/]http://www.missionariestopreborn.com/ [/a]
And this is the original thread on this forum about her: http://www.prolifeamerica.com/fusetalk/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=7&threadid=3439&enterthread=y

reply from: yoda

To be fair, that is Dan whom you quoted, not Donna.... two different people. Would you justify putting her in jail for his words? And I haven't seen the word "saint" used by anyone else here. Plus, you omitted this quote of Dan's: "I've killed deer, I've killed sheep, I've killed goats," Holman said. "But I would not bring myself to kill another human being, even though he deserves to die."
Good place to get accurate quotes.

reply from: joe

I know you are attacking the hero that was imprisoned doing her part in stopping this holocaust. Simple enough?

reply from: joe

Evaluation for disagreeing with a law that violates the inherent right to life. Who is the "extremist" concernedparent?????????????

reply from: yoda

No, I believe she is Dan's wife.
Because....... ???
If a biased judge ordered you to be "evaluated" by a biased psychiatrist, when you hadn't done anything illegal or wrong, would you not object?
INCLUDING SPECIFICALLY taking whatever "medication" s/he ordered her to take... and yes, all such drugs are "mind-altering".
And yet you're ready to pass judgment on her publicly?
What I said was that it was a "good place to get accurate quotes". Don't you think that is important before we pass judgment on someone?

reply from: yoda

It came directly off the MTTP website, so how could it not be "biased"?
Are you still reading? Or has posting negative things about her online delayed your reading?

reply from: joe

Don't understand the accusation concernedparent, associating individuals with groups is a weak attempt to win.
Just so you understand I have no affiliation with AOG. Is that clear enough?
I asked you this question before and you ignored it for fear of exposing your hypocrisy.
Do you consider individuals that tried to stop the executioners in the German Holocaust extremists worthy of imprisonment?

reply from: joe

I believe I answered this question many times from militants posting on this forum. You all attempt to compare abortion to the holocaust. No, we were not guilty of war crimes for defeating the Germans... Paul Hill was a murderer, though.
Double talk....still no answer (individual not nation). Why is the question so hard to answer? I would like to believe you are intelligent.
Not a holocaust...the slaughter of innocent human beings sanctioned by law. Sounds the same to me.

reply from: joe

According to you citizens of Germany were allowed to interfere with the government sanctioned slaughter of innocent human beings. False.
You are still avoiding answering a simple question.

reply from: faithman

Once again, CP the narsasist, humanist monky boy proves that, ultimatly, is no freind to the cause of life. This convict screw ball continuously slanders pro-lifers, useing pro-abort web sites as "proof". Donna Holman is a very soft spoken kind hearted granny, who's only crime has been handing out pro-life literature. Now this punk has smeared his crap over 2 threds that simply try to get real pro-life action in real life time. Reguardless if you agree with all her personal views, It is a fact that the pro-abort oficers have to read her mail before she gets it. Of course I don't expect his babooness to stop clutter this thred with hateful attacks on real pro-lifers, so I won't even ask. But I am asking real pro-lifers to drop her a post card or letter. Donna is also a divout christian, and a sted fast witness of the Lord Jesus to the lost. I would ask all the christians here, to send her materials so she can witness to her jail mates.
Donna Holman ; PO Box 2540 ; Iowa City, IA 52244

reply from: faithman

No, by blood, I believe she is Dan's mother.
Because....... ???
If a biased judge ordered you to be "evaluated" by a biased psychiatrist, when you hadn't done anything illegal or wrong, would you not object?
INCLUDING SPECIFICALLY taking whatever "medication" s/he ordered her to take... and yes, all such drugs are "mind-altering".
And yet you're ready to pass judgment on her publicly?
What I said was that it was a "good place to get accurate quotes". Don't you think that is important before we pass judgment on someone?
She is dan's wife, not mother. they have been married for 6 years.

reply from: jujujellybean

I know you are attacking the hero that was imprisoned doing her part in stopping this holocaust. Simple enough?
Joe and concernedparent, why are you guys mad at each other? Sounds like faithman and cp's fight carried over.

reply from: faithman

I know you are attacking the hero that was imprisoned doing her part in stopping this holocaust. Simple enough?
Joe and concernedparent, why are you guys mad at each other? Sounds like faithman and cp's fight carried over.
Because Joe can recognize a phony humanist punk when he sees one. CP always slings crap on threds that call for real prolife activity. He can stand for anyone, or anything to take attention away from his self agrandized image of himself.

reply from: joe

Still not a direct answer, you clearly know the consequences if you answer the question. You are playing word games. Just a simple yes or no.
Do you consider individuals that tried to stop the executioners in the German Holocaust extremists worthy of imprisonment?
Let your silence confirm your hypocrisy.

reply from: joe

For the second time, no!
Then shut your mouth about Donna Holman.................hypocrite.

reply from: GodsLaw4Us2Live

For the second time, no!
Then shut your mouth about Donna Holman.................hypocrite.
The Dan and Donna Holman website supports "Justifiable Homocide", therefor, we cannot support them. They have come off the track and have moved into serious and deadly territory. They need to be reprimanded, not showered with support.

reply from: yoda

You're right. I'd have to have a lot more than rumor and innuendo before I'd attack someone like her.
If being a prolife makes me on board with them, then you are on board also, right? But yes, until I know otherwise, I'm going to give any fully dedicated prolifer the benefit of the doubt over a proabort judge. I have met prolifers all over this country of ours, and I've learned that I can trust them based on nothing else but the knowledge that they are genuine prolifers. I see you haven't learned that yet.
Bu this is all deja-vu all over again, isn't it? So instead of rehashing the same argument we had over Troy Newman, could you just tell me what dedicated prolife leader you would not attack? Are there any?

reply from: yoda

The truth can be either negative or positive, can't it?
Why do you always look for the negative first with regard to prolife leaders?

reply from: yoda

Maybe so, but not by you, and not here.

reply from: faithman

You're right. I'd have to have a lot more than rumor and innuendo before I'd attack someone like her.
If being a prolife makes me on board with them, then you are on board also, right? But yes, until I know otherwise, I'm going to give any fully dedicated prolifer the benefit of the doubt over a proabort judge. I have met prolifers all over this country of ours, and I've learned that I can trust them based on nothing else but the knowledge that they are genuine prolifers. I see you haven't learned that yet.
Bu this is all deja-vu all over again, isn't it? So instead of rehashing the same argument we had over Troy Newman, could you just tell me what dedicated prolife leader you would not attack? Are there any?
If one would fall down at gibon gums thrown of self exalted intelect, and lavish praise for trivial posting on a forum as the most important work in all the world, he might have something good to say.

reply from: faithman

You're right. I'd have to have a lot more than rumor and innuendo before I'd attack someone like her.
If being a prolife makes me on board with them, then you are on board also, right? But yes, until I know otherwise, I'm going to give any fully dedicated prolifer the benefit of the doubt over a proabort judge. I have met prolifers all over this country of ours, and I've learned that I can trust them based on nothing else but the knowledge that they are genuine prolifers. I see you haven't learned that yet.
Bu this is all deja-vu all over again, isn't it? So instead of rehashing the same argument we had over Troy Newman, could you just tell me what dedicated prolife leader you would not attack? Are there any?
Yoda, there is not one swinging Richard on the face of this earth above reproach. Not you, not me, not Donna and not Troy. If you're wrong, you're wrong. I do not enjoy the luxury of believing what is most attractive to me. I call them like I see them, and fame, money, recognition, none of it will influence me to bite my tongue. There are no "heroes." We are all accountable...
except you, who has been proven wrong and slanderous with your attacks, and yet you refuse to recant for your pro-abortesk attacks on lifers who do real work in real time.

reply from: GodsLaw4Us2Live

Maybe so, but not by you, and not here.
On that point you are wrong. We are all here to help one another. Words have meaning, and they must be dealt with, not ignored. If one says "Justifiable Homicide" is justified, is that statement not going to influence others? It calls for an immediate repudiation. We should be working, always working, for the good of everyone.

reply from: joe

You would crucify our Christ because you were ordered to. Let the blood of the unborn children be your judgment.

reply from: joe

concernedparent you are truly .

reply from: joe

You are hypocritical in your beliefs, now you are blind to the holocaust. Sorry concernedparent you are living a lie. Maybe it helps you sleep at night knowing you are doing all you can? You have to believe what you believe so you can feel "great" about yourself.
You have exposed your hypocrisy about Donna Holman so you cover it up and deny the holocaust. I choose not to live in ignorance. So go play in your dreamland, have some milk and cookies. Maybe someone can read you a story for your nap.

reply from: faithman

You are hypocritical in your beliefs, now you are blind to the holocaust. Sorry concernedparent you are living a lie. Maybe it helps you sleep at night knowing you are doing all you can? You have to believe what you believe so you can feel "great" about yourself.
You have exposed your hypocrisy about Donna Holman so you cover it up and deny the holocaust. I choose not to live in ignorance. So go play in your dreamland, have some milk and cookies. Maybe someone can read you a story for your nap.
Maybe he can call up his prison buddies and remaniss about dropping the soap together.

reply from: faithman

You are hypocritical in your beliefs, now you are blind to the holocaust. Sorry concernedparent you are living a lie. Maybe it helps you sleep at night knowing you are doing all you can? You have to believe what you believe so you can feel "great" about yourself.
You have exposed your hypocrisy about Donna Holman so you cover it up and deny the holocaust. I choose not to live in ignorance. So go play in your dreamland, have some milk and cookies. Maybe someone can read you a story for your nap.
Ha Ha! You came spoiling for a fight, then when you get one, you're at a loss! Why am I not surprised?
The joke is on you monky boy. Now every one sees what a phony jerk you are. Once agasin you attack a real prolifer doing real work, and then claim some kind of deluded victory you simply don't have. All this thred was supose to do was provide an address to send pro-life material for pro-abort scancs to read. Now you clutter it up with your delusional drivel. For one who is so in love with their suposed inteligence, you are really very stupid.

reply from: yoda

Never claimed that. But reproaching someone publicly is not a trivial matter. It should only be done by someone who is in a position of authority, either moral or legal, and it should be done in the most discrete manner possible, so as not to give aid and comfort to the enemy.

reply from: yoda

You can repudiate all you want to, but you have no authority to "reprimand" anyone here. You are not a moderator, nor do I recognize any moral authority vested in you to reprimand people on this board. Meanwhile, this petty squabbling serves to aid and comfort the enemy. Click on the little blue link if you want someone reprimanded.

reply from: yoda

And you see that as your function here? Even if these "bad tidings" come from highly suspect sources?

reply from: yoda

It's way too late to ask that, don't you think? Have you ever had an unexpressed thought on this forum?
But neither you nor anyone else (other than the moderator, or MC3) has any authority to "reprimand" anyone here.

reply from: faithman

Never claimed that. But reproaching someone publicly is not a trivial matter. It should only be done by someone who is in a position of authority, either moral or legal, and it should be done in the most discrete manner possible, so as not to give aid and comfort to the enemy.
You have to understand yoda, this punk is the enemy. His "bad tidings" have all been proven to be slanderous twisted half truth lies. He garners the praise of bortheads, agrees with the number one enemy of the womb child, planned parenthood, and just like the bortheads, claims to be smarter than anyone else dispite the fact he has been exposed for being a phony. Now he clutters up a thread with his monky poop, that is calling for real pro-life action, in real time. Donna Holman is one of the kindest souls on the planet. The charges are false as proven by the vidios anyone can view on the net. Put CP, just like the bull dyke pro-abort judge, refuses to look at the evidence if it totally blows their crap away. The issue of this thread is, that pro-abortion police have to read her mail as part of their job. Now don't it seem like a good pro-life thing to do to send her pro-life material? But CP is all to eager to help the bortheads smear real prolife action in real time. Only a simpleton would think he is anything other than a 5th column borthead subversive. And the reason I aposed many of you having him banned, is because he is a good lesson for everone to see what a false pro-lifer looks like.

reply from: yoda

You can try, sure.... but what good does it do? All it does is to stir up more trouble, and make the proaborts happy. Expressing your disagreement is one thing, trying to "call someone down" without any authority to do so will only result in another chapter of the "Hatfield and McCoy Feud".

reply from: faithman

Is this the same Fboy who contends that this battle won't be won with words? Do you contend that sending Donna a letter in which you refer to prochoicers as "scanks," maggots, lowlifes, babykillers, and all the other insults you routinely hurl will positively influence any "pro-abortion police" that have to read her mail in a positive way? Is that it? Or are you really implying that you never believed the crap you spew to start with? That you really understand that you are hurting the cause with your vile spewing of venom? It must be one or the other....
Why? because a secular humanist convict phony says so? Just like your borthead buddies, you use half truths, and twisted thinking to slander an honest pro-life effort. It ain't just about the scanc police. Most bort heads never convert anyway, and I could care less what they think. I just find it funny that they will have to sit down and veiw all that pro-life material, and do so for a month. And by the way gorilla gums, I have photo copied baby pictures into every letter I sent, so it ain't just words poop flinger, it is the pictures of womb life that you sell out on a daily basis at the alter of your ego. I hurt no cause, particularly this one that has no more toes to shoot off. So post some more stupidity because your itty piddy secular humanist convict phony 5th column feelings got hurt, and you intend to carry out a vendetta, against anyone, and anything that does not adore your self exalted intelect. How are you able to pull off such a sherade? I also asked christians to send witnessing matirials, because Donna is a perpetual witness of the Lord Jesus Christ, and could use the material to witness to her cell mates. But because you are also a Christ hater, you left that part out, now didn't you.

reply from: yoda

Well, you should be a moderator, for starters. Or at least an "authority figure" (and I don't think we have any of those here). If you're neither one of those, then all you're doing is flapping your gums, and possibly exacerbating the problem.

reply from: faithman

So, you admit that your purpose for posting on this thread is your own amusement? You are asking us to waste time mailing literature you assert will do no good, just because you think it would be "funny?"
Number one, I am not asking you to do anything but stop cluttering this thred with your lies. number 2, I did not say just for my amusement, it is an encouragement to a real pro-lifer that you have slandered. Most pro-lifers do not consider that a waist of time, and many have already done so. Where did I say it would do no good? Once again you deficate on what was really said. Pro aborts have to read everything she gets. She is a perpetual witness no matter where she is, and I am sure her cell mates are already aware of that fact. But all you want to do is waist time slandering real pro-lifers doing real work in real time. Which is the major reason Mark set up this forum, so real pro-lifers could net work to do real work. We only tolerate you phonies because it shows real prolifers what phonies look like, and what their tactics are. You have been a prime example of that, and for that we are greatful. Now will you let us get back to real work? Don't you have a Planned Parenthood conference on how to disrupt a pro-lifer forum conference to teach or something? Run along little monky, your entertainment value is wearing thin.

reply from: faithman

Never claimed that. But reproaching someone publicly is not a trivial matter. It should only be done by someone who is in a position of authority, either moral or legal, and it should be done in the most discrete manner possible, so as not to give aid and comfort to the enemy.
You have to understand yoda, this punk is the enemy. His "bad tidings" have all been proven to be slanderous twisted half truth lies. He garners the praise of bortheads, agrees with the number one enemy of the womb child, planned parenthood, and just like the bortheads, claims to be smarter than anyone else dispite the fact he has been exposed for being a phony. Now he clutters up a thread with his monky poop, that is calling for real pro-life action, in real time. Donna Holman is one of the kindest souls on the planet. The charges are false as proven by the vidios anyone can view on the net. Put CP, just like the bull dyke pro-abort judge, refuses to look at the evidence if it totally blows their crap away. The issue of this thread is, that pro-abortion police have to read her mail as part of their job. Now don't it seem like a good pro-life thing to do to send her pro-life material? But CP is all to eager to help the bortheads smear real prolife action in real time. Only a simpleton would think he is anything other than a 5th column borthead subversive. And the reason I aposed many of you having him banned, is because he is a good lesson for everone to see what a false pro-lifer looks like.
I won't to respond to all the lies you have told here. (There are so many....) I will, however, offer some thoughts on Donna Holman. Did she defy a court order? Of course she did...That is certainly not a "false charge." This case is being misrepresented by those, like Fboy, who support violent overthrow of the government. They feel that if they convince people a sweet little old lady was unjustly persecuted just for trying to save babies, it might elicit public support for their cause.
If their cause were simply to protect children, I would have no objections to that, but would still object to the dishonesty in implying that Donna was jailed for sidewalk counseling. That is not the case. The judge did not jail her for the alleged harassment. Based on the Holman's obvious support of militant activism, even condoning murder, the judge had a responsibility to allay the fears of clinic employees and patrons. Donna Holman intentionally defied the court order, forcing the judge to imprison her for contempt.
I have no objection to such a sacrifice in order to gain pro-life publicity, but I object to putting a dishonest spin on it as has been done here. I'm certain I'm not the only one who sees through this publicity stunt, and I'm equally certain this is not good publicity for prolife.
The only one who has put a dishonest spin on things is you. The video tape was clear that she was doing nothing else other than trieing to hand out literature. She was jailed because she was ordered to undergo a pysc exame, and take drugs if the borthead doc said so. this was a misdomener charge, and did not call for this kind of order. If you did real life work, in real time, you would know how the bortheads trump things up, and will tell any lie they can to discredit people they hate. OH but wait!!! You are very well versed in, and allied with, bortheads on that one now aren't we?

reply from: carolemarie

You lie. The judge only ordered her to get the exam. The only mention of forcing her to take meds was from Donna in her own statement. So what if she only handed out literature? She is still associated with violent extremists. The judge had a duty to send her for an evaluation, and Donna had nothing to fear from doing so. She intentionally defied the court order in order to get publicity, which is fine by me, but don't pretend she was unjustly prosecuted. She was not jailed for the complaint of harassment, but for defying the court order....
I suppose the judge was worried that she might be another Paul Hill. After all, he made many statements in favor of killing that Doctor before he did it. Perhaps he just wanted to make sure she wasn't going to practice justifable homicide?
I think that it wouldn't have hurt her to do the evaluation. I understand being mad at being ordered to take one, but in light of her history of being married to a man who supports killing Doctors, maybe the judge was trying to protect the Doctor from a possible violent attack....
Judges and cops have a duty to make sure that dangerous people don't get to hurt other people (serve and protect)

reply from: yoda

Nah, I mean filling page after forum page with nasty attacks on 72 year old prolife women trying to save babies...... and any who dare to defend her.

reply from: yoda

Preventive detention? Is that how you're justifying what the proabort judge did? Suppose some wacky judge decides that YOU may go off your rocker SOMEDAY IN THE FUTURE and demands that you see a "court appointed shrink"? Will you be all smiley and understanding then? (Preventive detention is illegal, by the way.)
OH YEAH.... being MARRIED to the WRONG MAN is a SERIOUS OFFENSE....... ISN'T IT??????
I'm really amazed that you would be piling onto this poor old woman.

reply from: carolemarie

I am not saying Donna did anything wrong. I was reflecting on perhaps why the judge reacted the way she did.
Sometimes we cause our own misery....this justifable killing talk hurts innocent people, like Donna
The judge has a duty to everyones safety, that means the DR. at the clinic as well, and if you are going around with a group that talks up killing, it would be conceivable that it would concern people.
If the Dr. was shot and nobody had bothered to do anything there would be much screaming and gnashing of teeth then.
I think it was an outrageous thing to require, but perhaps it wasn't completely out of the ballpark....
I feel bad for Donna, I don't think she was treated right, but she could have just gone to the shrink and been cleared of any malfeasance and would never have gone to jail in the first place.

reply from: yoda

Nah, not really....... the "exam" was just an excuse to put her away...
The real kicker was when the person who filed the complaint did not show up in court..... and instead of throwing the complaint out, as is customary when the complainant doesn't show, the judge ruled that she would just accept hearsay evidence against her.
Can you read my posts all the way through without stopping to think up profanities and half-truths? If you can, respond to that last paragraph, please.

reply from: yoda

That is what carole suggested in her post. Calm down, read more slowly....

reply from: yoda

I see.... so you don't think that her being a proabort had anything to do with it?
And you don't think that the fact that the judge outright refused to look at a video of the WHOLE incident in question....... and the fact that the person who filed the complaint failed to show up, but the judge ruled they could proceed on nothing but hearsay evidence..... shows evidence of proabort bias?
Just how blind do you want to be on this matter?

reply from: faithman

Yes you are baby killer. You claim to have done side walk work for 13 years. SSSSSSOOOOOOO you don't think that the bortheads won't use this case to sweep all picketers into mental wards if they can get away with it? You can't see what stands between us and simular action is a brave 72 year old granny who's only crime is doing what you claim to have done for 13 years? It is stupid for any pro-lifer to agree with a borthead conspiracy to violate the rights of pro-life citizens. Hve you taken the time to view the video evidence the scanc judge did not allow into the case? And just how many other misdamenor cases has the judge ordered such action? If you weant to agree with the oppression of our enemies, then quit calling yourself Pro-life. With murdering friends like you, we certainly don't need enemies.

reply from: faithman

Just recieved a post card from Donna. She is doing well, and apreciates all the cards, letters and materials. Please keep up the good work, and keep sending stuff in to this missionary behind bars. Remeber that the bortheads have to read it first, and Donna has a real pinchant for sharing her faith. .....and all you fake pro-lifers can send your crap as to why you think she should stop defending all our pro-life 1st amendment rights. Go figure... a 72 year old granny has more guts than the borthead subversives who would have her surender all our rights to secular humanist socialist, who want to stick you in a mental ward, and court order doping, of anyone who would dare stand for the womb child.

reply from: sheri

fboy, stop calling carole marie a baby killer or im going to report you. and you know i will.

reply from: faithman

Oh so she is not? report away!!!

reply from: yoda

What "history" and what "associations"?
Does being married to the "wrong" person make you mentally "suspect"? Or is belonging to the "wrong" organization proof that you are mentally "suspect"?
When you've calmed down enough, and can read my posts without flying into a rage, think over these two things: The judge would not look at the video they had of the whole incident, and the person who filed the complaint did not show up in court. Any other court would've dismissed the complaint for a no-show, but that judge ruled that "hearsay" evidence would be admitted instead.
Now, how can you consider that without reaching the conclusion that it was a kangaroo court?

reply from: yoda

Well, that's the proper procedure. But that isn't a profanity, you know?

reply from: carolemarie

Yes you are baby killer. You claim to have done side walk work for 13 years. SSSSSSOOOOOOO you don't think that the bortheads won't use this case to sweep all picketers into mental wards if they can get away with it? You can't see what stands between us and simular action is a brave 72 year old granny who's only crime is doing what you claim to have done for 13 years? It is stupid for any pro-lifer to agree with a borthead conspiracy to violate the rights of pro-life citizens. Hve you taken the time to view the video evidence the scanc judge did not allow into the case? And just how many other misdamenor cases has the judge ordered such action? If you weant to agree with the oppression of our enemies, then quit calling yourself Pro-life. With murdering friends like you, we certainly don't need enemies.
If they came and insisted that I had a psyc evaluation I would have done it rather than gone to jail. I don't like jail and don't want to be in one.
I support Donna's right to peacefully talk to women going into the abortion clinic. I also acknowlege that it would be very scary to be an abortion provider and have the Hollomans hanging out advocating that someone shoot you.
Most of us would find it reasonable to stop and check if the Muslims talking about flying planes into buildings to kill Americans were serious or a threat. If a judge said they have the right to talk like that and we couldn't bother them and then they flew the plane into the building we would all be looking for a rope.

Sometimes our rhetoric cost us more than we intended. This may be one of those cases.

reply from: faithman

Yes you are baby killer. You claim to have done side walk work for 13 years. SSSSSSOOOOOOO you don't think that the bortheads won't use this case to sweep all picketers into mental wards if they can get away with it? You can't see what stands between us and simular action is a brave 72 year old granny who's only crime is doing what you claim to have done for 13 years? It is stupid for any pro-lifer to agree with a borthead conspiracy to violate the rights of pro-life citizens. Hve you taken the time to view the video evidence the scanc judge did not allow into the case? And just how many other misdamenor cases has the judge ordered such action? If you weant to agree with the oppression of our enemies, then quit calling yourself Pro-life. With murdering friends like you, we certainly don't need enemies.
If they came and insisted that I had a psyc evaluation I would have done it rather than gone to jail. I don't like jail and don't want to be in one.
I support Donna's right to peacefully talk to women going into the abortion clinic. I also acknowlege that it would be very scary to be an abortion provider and have the Hollomans hanging out advocating that someone shoot you.
Most of us would find it reasonable to stop and check if the Muslims talking about flying planes into buildings to kill Americans were serious or a threat. If a judge said they have the right to talk like that and we couldn't bother them and then they flew the plane into the building we would all be looking for a rope.

Sometimes our rhetoric cost us more than we intended. This may be one of those cases.
That is because you are a coward, and have little understanding what this case is really about. SSSSSOOOO why would you care if a baby killer was scared? Oh! thats Right, you are one.

reply from: yoda

Which is what the tape (that the judge refused to look at) showed she was doing.
Do you really, honestly believe that Ms. Holloman was doing that?
Oh, and how often have you heard of a psych evaluation being ordered in connection with a trial on a misdemeanor charge?

reply from: faithman

Which is what the tape (that the judge refused to look at) showed she was doing.
Do you really, honestly believe that Ms. Holloman was doing that?
Oh, and how often have you heard of a psych evaluation being ordered in connection with a trial on a misdemeanor charge?
Facts don't matter to a baby killer, and they haven't seen a real prolifer yet they don't mind smearing with half truths, and blatant lies. May haps the abortion machine suck a little grey matter as well?

reply from: GodsLaw4Us2Live

The Justifiable Use of Force, by Dan Holman (last paragraphs of his article):
"Does acknowledging the justifiable use of force oblige us to kill an abortionist? Most of us are not as courageous as Paul Hill. There are no Christian suicide bombers blowing up abortion clinics. We need to confess and acknowledge our lack of love toward God and the pre-born. It is wrong to vilify the courageous acts of Paul Hill to put our own weakness and cowardice in a better light. As long as there is confusion in doctrine among those who are against abortion, the world will not come to understand our message. "A mist in the pulpit is a fog in the pew." Heretics and heresy must be dealt with openly and harshly.
None of us deserve the honor of standing with Paul Hill on the Day of Judgment. He truly stands alone."
The above speaks for itself, it's from the Army of God website. Paul Hill shot and killed an abortionist and his bodyguard. Dan Holman exhibits the same attitude as a Taliban or Al-Qaida suicide bomber.
It is wrong, wrong, wrong for Faithman or Joe to support Donna or Dan Holman because they have posted extremist statements encouraging murder and violence.

reply from: carolemarie

Yes you are baby killer. You claim to have done side walk work for 13 years. SSSSSSOOOOOOO you don't think that the bortheads won't use this case to sweep all picketers into mental wards if they can get away with it? You can't see what stands between us and simular action is a brave 72 year old granny who's only crime is doing what you claim to have done for 13 years? It is stupid for any pro-lifer to agree with a borthead conspiracy to violate the rights of pro-life citizens. Hve you taken the time to view the video evidence the scanc judge did not allow into the case? And just how many other misdamenor cases has the judge ordered such action? If you weant to agree with the oppression of our enemies, then quit calling yourself Pro-life. With murdering friends like you, we certainly don't need enemies.
If they came and insisted that I had a psyc evaluation I would have done it rather than gone to jail. I don't like jail and don't want to be in one.
I support Donna's right to peacefully talk to women going into the abortion clinic. I also acknowlege that it would be very scary to be an abortion provider and have the Hollomans hanging out advocating that someone shoot you.
Most of us would find it reasonable to stop and check if the Muslims talking about flying planes into buildings to kill Americans were serious or a threat. If a judge said they have the right to talk like that and we couldn't bother them and then they flew the plane into the building we would all be looking for a rope.

Sometimes our rhetoric cost us more than we intended. This may be one of those cases.
That is because you are a coward, and have little understanding what this case is really about. SSSSSOOOO why would you care if a baby killer was scared? Oh! thats Right, you are one.
I don't hate abortion providers or those who are pro-abortion. They are deluded and wrong, but they are not my enemies. God loves them as much as he loves the babies who die and He wants all men to come to Him and not one of them to perish. He isn't out to get them or punish them! He is out to love them and bless them with His love forever.

reply from: carolemarie

Yes you are baby killer. You claim to have done side walk work for 13 years. SSSSSSOOOOOOO you don't think that the bortheads won't use this case to sweep all picketers into mental wards if they can get away with it? You can't see what stands between us and simular action is a brave 72 year old granny who's only crime is doing what you claim to have done for 13 years? It is stupid for any pro-lifer to agree with a borthead conspiracy to violate the rights of pro-life citizens. Hve you taken the time to view the video evidence the scanc judge did not allow into the case? And just how many other misdamenor cases has the judge ordered such action? If you weant to agree with the oppression of our enemies, then quit calling yourself Pro-life. With murdering friends like you, we certainly don't need enemies.
You are a bit paranoid, and I can see how you would be afraid that you would pass a pysch exam, but it really isn't a viable way to remove prolifers from the clinics.

reply from: yoda

And you know they are "liars" because........ ???? Oh wait, it's because they belong to the AOG, and everyone who belongs to that organization always lies about everything, right? Well, at least you're not biased...... Oh, and did you read the transcript? How did you do that?
So they were "actual witnesses" eh? Do you have a link to any of that?
Yes, and I see you don't even bother to deny that the judge refused to look at it, but instead just put your spin on what you think is on the tape. That's pretty lame, even by your standards.
And with a radical proabort judge picking the shrink, you can bet the "treatment" would be something that would disable her, and keep her from her normal prolife activities. But you wouldn't know anything about "prolife activities", would you?
Oh MY, oh MY........ now you're attacking her because she's married to Dan........ that's LOW DOWN even for you!!
The bottom line of this discussion is that you've shown a complete disregard for the truth, and a complete willingness to accept any and all proabort slants on this story you can find anywhere.
It wouldn't matter if the judge and everyone else in this situation came out and admitted railroading Donna, you'd still continue your nasty attacks on her character because YOU WANT TO WIN THIS ARGUMENT........ and you don't care how you do it.
So it's really pointless for me to continue to debate you, or converse with you on any level..... I think it's time for the Iggy button again. NOW you can "claim victory" over me as many times as you like, and I won't dispute it. Will that make you "happy"? No, I thought not......

reply from: yoda

You quote a statement by Dan and then just throw in Donna's name for good measure?
You don't think they are two different people? Really?

reply from: yoda

You're right. They are the enemies of the babies. They're not out to kill us (for the most part), they're out to kill the babies.
So, you can be friends with them, since they're not out to kill YOU, right?

reply from: faithman

I have resently recieved a card from this kind gentle lady. She is doing well and apreciates all the cards and letters. Please ignore the monky poop of CP and continue to send her material. She is a shining light in the darkness even behind bars. Despite the lies of phony pro-lifers, you need to understand the broad implecations of this case. This brave lady had the courage to sacrifice freedom to protect it for the rest of us. We must never let a borthead judge establish a tactic that puts all pro-lifers at risk of court ordered doping for simple misdemener charges. She should be thanked, not slandered.

reply from: yoda

Do you suppose maybe it's jealousy that drives these nasty attempts at character assassination? Could it be that these "I do nothing but tear other people down" posters are just so jealous of someone who has sacrificed all they have, and dedicated their whole life to saving babies that they just can't help themselves?

reply from: faithman

plausible.... Makes you wounder who's side they are really on. Qh that right, they are on their own side, and don't care who they hurt, as long as they can declare themselves the winner of a meaningless debate. The deluded could care less about real issues, as long as they can show what an evolved ape they are. It shouldn't suprise anyone that those who think they came from a baboon to have the logic of one, or for a baby killer to want the abortionist to feel safe while they assasinate womb children. Maybe there is room for jealousy as well, but I think jealousy would have trouble finding room next to such an enormous ego.

reply from: carolemarie

You're right. They are the enemies of the babies. They're not out to kill us (for the most part), they're out to kill the babies.
So, you can be friends with them, since they're not out to kill YOU, right?
Because you don't change minds by refusing to talk to people who disagree with you. I want them to change sides and by demonizing them, you make them less than human. They are worth as much as the babies to God, and by extention then to me.

reply from: joe

That right, we should have had tea with Hitler and maybe he would have listened and stopped killing innocent people.

reply from: faithman

That right, we should have had tea with Hitler and maybe he would have listened and stopped killing innocent people.
CM you are simply wrong on many levels. No one is demonizing anyone. The bortheads do that to themselves. They gave up their humanity when they killed innocent life. You do not reason with an unreasonable evil aggressor. You make them stop by what ever means nessisary. They are not worth the same to God, as the scripture very clearly teaches that God hates the workers of iniquity, and His wrath abides on them in both the old and new testiment. You are trying to make God in your image of Him and that is idolitry. You love baby killers more than the babies because you are one. You would prefer that they go on killing, and feel safe doing it, than actually stopping them from butchering womb children. I don't care to change their minds, my issue is make them stop killing children. It is idiots like you, with your stupid positions that have made it almost imposible to do.

reply from: sheri

fboy, youve got the market cornered on stupid so you shouldnt point the finger. Do you believe there is no redemtion? That God would turn His back on His repentent child? You not only show your ignorance now you show your lack of faith if you are saying God is incapable of forgiving people. By continueing to call CM a baby killer you are saying to everyone viewing your inane rantings that God does not forgive , and in my book that is the worst form of blasphamy. Im under the impression that you are a plant ffrom the enemy sent to make prolifers look like crass and nasty jerks.

reply from: carolemarie

That right, we should have had tea with Hitler and maybe he would have listened and stopped killing innocent people.
CM you are simply wrong on many levels. No one is demonizing anyone. The bortheads do that to themselves. They gave up their humanity when they killed innocent life. You do not reason with an unreasonable evil aggressor. You make them stop by what ever means nessisary. They are not worth the same to God, as the scripture very clearly teaches that God hates the workers of iniquity, and His wrath abides on them in both the old and new testiment. You are trying to make God in your image of Him and that is idolitry. You love baby killers more than the babies because you are one. You would prefer that they go on killing, and feel safe doing it, than actually stopping them from butchering womb children. I don't care to change their minds, my issue is make them stop killing children. It is idiots like you, with your stupid positions that have made it almost imposible to do.
God desires that all men come to him and that none perish. That is why He sent His only Son to die for our sins so we can be forgiven. Even abortion providers are not beyond his grace and mercy! God is LOVE. And because He is LOVE, He is kind, patient, longsuffering. The kindness of God leads men to repentance. Additionally He tells us that as we judge others, we will be judged. Which is even more motivation to extend grace rather than a shotgun. Trust the Judge of all the earth to work it out. He doesn't need our help!

reply from: faithman

This is where you are a stupid gullible twerp. I have not heard one word of repentance from CM. She is self justified, and has made several excuses as to why she murdered her children. And if she truely has repented, of which there is no evidence to that fact, she would admit to being a murderer, not just someone who made a youthful mistake, and would understand, and admit, that though forgiven, will always be a forgiven murderer, but a murderer just the same. Anything else dishonors the children she killed, and excusses the abortionist to continue to murder womb children. This is evident by the fact that she was concerned more about the abortionist feeling comfy murderering children, than the rights of Donna Holman making a stand for womb life. You can not agree with the enemy of womb children and call yourself pro-life.

reply from: sheri

if 13 years of side walk counseling isnt enough to prove to you she is repentant nothing is. We make our apolagies to God, we sure as heck dont have anything to prove to you and you shouldnt expect proof. you are a plant and its time someone called you on it.

reply from: faithman

That right, we should have had tea with Hitler and maybe he would have listened and stopped killing innocent people.
CM you are simply wrong on many levels. No one is demonizing anyone. The bortheads do that to themselves. They gave up their humanity when they killed innocent life. You do not reason with an unreasonable evil aggressor. You make them stop by what ever means nessisary. They are not worth the same to God, as the scripture very clearly teaches that God hates the workers of iniquity, and His wrath abides on them in both the old and new testiment. You are trying to make God in your image of Him and that is idolitry. You love baby killers more than the babies because you are one. You would prefer that they go on killing, and feel safe doing it, than actually stopping them from butchering womb children. I don't care to change their minds, my issue is make them stop killing children. It is idiots like you, with your stupid positions that have made it almost imposible to do.
God desires that all men come to him and that none perish. That is why He sent His only Son to die for our sins so we can be forgiven. Even abortion providers are not beyond his grace and mercy! God is LOVE. And because He is LOVE, He is kind, patient, longsuffering. The kindness of God leads men to repentance. Additionally He tells us that as we judge others, we will be judged. Which is even more motivation to extend grace rather than a shotgun. Trust the Judge of all the earth to work it out. He doesn't need our help!
There are those who are beyond grace, as the scripture very clearly teaches. God turns them over to a reprobate mind, at which point their eternal doom is sealed forever. The scripture teaches very clearly that some will not come to the light, and are condemned already because their deeds are evil. Don't just cherry pick verses to promote a perverted theology. Read John 3: 15 thru 21, not just John 3:16. The scripture also teaches in Romans 13, that government is to be a terror to evil doers. Our founding documents say we the people are the government. Our second amendment puts the power to protect innocent life in the hands of the citizen. This is not my judgement, but God's. This is not murder like you commited against your own children, nor vengance like some would try to say. This is about protecting the life of a child, which is something you failed at. Or do you still not consider the life of a womb child valuable , like when yopu made that youthful mistake?

reply from: faithman

You are an idiot to think that one should not have to prove they are pro-life. Side walk counseling is a duty, not an act of pentace. True repentance is based on confession of wrong doing, not some half baked excuse. Either abortion is murder, or it is not. If it is, then those who do it are murderers. If they have truely repented, then they are forgiven, but in this world they are still a murderer. Other wise you agree with PP that a womb child has no value. You simply can not have it both ways. You can not call yourself pro-life, and be in agreement with those who slaughter womb children for a living.

reply from: carolemarie

That right, we should have had tea with Hitler and maybe he would have listened and stopped killing innocent people.
CM you are simply wrong on many levels. No one is demonizing anyone. The bortheads do that to themselves. They gave up their humanity when they killed innocent life. You do not reason with an unreasonable evil aggressor. You make them stop by what ever means nessisary. They are not worth the same to God, as the scripture very clearly teaches that God hates the workers of iniquity, and His wrath abides on them in both the old and new testiment. You are trying to make God in your image of Him and that is idolitry. You love baby killers more than the babies because you are one. You would prefer that they go on killing, and feel safe doing it, than actually stopping them from butchering womb children. I don't care to change their minds, my issue is make them stop killing children. It is idiots like you, with your stupid positions that have made it almost imposible to do.
God desires that all men come to him and that none perish. That is why He sent His only Son to die for our sins so we can be forgiven. Even abortion providers are not beyond his grace and mercy! God is LOVE. And because He is LOVE, He is kind, patient, longsuffering. The kindness of God leads men to repentance. Additionally He tells us that as we judge others, we will be judged. Which is even more motivation to extend grace rather than a shotgun. Trust the Judge of all the earth to work it out. He doesn't need our help!
There are those who are beyond grace, as the scripture very clearly teaches. God turns them over to a reprobate mind, at which point their eternal doom is sealed forever. The scripture teaches very clearly that some will not come to the light, and are condemned already because their deeds are evil. Don't just cherry pick verses to promote a perverted theology. Read John 3: 15 thru 21, not just John 3:16. The scripture also teaches in Romans 13, that government is to be a terror to evil doers. Our founding documents say we the people are the government. Our second amendment puts the power to protect innocent life in the hands of the citizen. This is not my judgement, but God's. This is not murder like you commited against your own children, nor vengance like some would try to say. This is about protecting the life of a child, which is something you failed at. Or do you still not consider the life of a womb child valuable , like when yopu made that youthful mistake?
We have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. But while we were yet sinners, God sent His one and only Son, that whoever believes in HIm will not perish but have eternal life. God wants all men to turn to Him.
Well, the government was a terror to Paul Hill because he was an evil doer. We also have in the founding documents the way we are to petition for redress of wrongs. It doesn't involve killing anyone.

There is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus....
I don't call you names, so quit calling me a babykiller.

reply from: sheri

I hope anyone who may read this knows this twerp ("faithman", talk about wrong on both counts) is a pro abort not a prolifer. a prolifer would know Jesus is Mercy Itself and is very open to welcome His lost sheep back. Also prolifers dont condem and belittle those who do what they can to save babies. Also prolifers arent mean for no reason.

reply from: carolemarie

You are an idiot to think that one should not have to prove they are pro-life. Side walk counseling is a duty, not an act of pentace. True repentance is based on confession of wrong doing, not some half baked excuse. Either abortion is murder, or it is not. If it is, then those who do it are murderers. If they have truely repented, then they are forgiven, but in this world they are still a murderer. Other wise you agree with PP that a womb child has no value. You simply can not have it both ways. You can not call yourself pro-life, and be in agreement with those who slaughter womb children for a living.
If you are forgiven then you are no longer guilty of anything and get to be treated like everyone else. Sometimes those who are pro-choice can be right and then you have to agree with them. They are not always wrong


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